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Old 02-28-2011, 11:52 AM
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In all fairness all of these cartridges have both positive and negative characteristics. Having said that I'm thinking you should be deciding on the firearm you want based on it's characteristics and your criteria. It'll tell you what cartridge you will use.
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Old 02-28-2011, 11:41 PM
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Knowing your objective is one side to the decision of which round is best. But in a SHTF scenario versatility is what made me decide on the M1A platform. I may not have the choice on what distance to defend myself, or choice in what animal is available. So to say this round for this situation, and that round for that situation might have more to do with luxury of choice. The M1A might not be a better choice over a bolt rifle on the 1000 yard target, it might be a little slower than the lighter platforms for target acquisition and sight alignment, but it can still do everything all the others can do. Usually there is some restriction, but with the M1A it's the do all choice.
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Old 02-28-2011, 11:56 PM
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Mine will be .308 in a SCAR 17s.
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Old 03-01-2011, 04:39 AM
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The 2 sporting goods stores near me that sell guns & ammo don't carry 7.62x39 . Makes me think the 7.62 is only popular/common with the survivalist crowd .
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Old 03-01-2011, 06:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodswalker View Post
The 2 sporting goods stores near me that sell guns & ammo don't carry 7.62x39 . Makes me think the 7.62 is only popular/common with the survivalist crowd .
This is very true, but I think its getting harder to get and the most complained about as far as jamming. Dealers don't want to deal with all that. Plus they can't compete on any level with online ordering prices. Looking like Wallyworld is getting out of it too. They are only getting one 20ct box at a time where I live. SKS's have had a BIG jump in the last 2 years because of survival people, who never being gun people, were looking for an inexpensive rifle and ammo as you say, not so cheap anymore. Another thing is I would never use it to hunt deer and the like because I have other choices in cal. If it were my only choice I would though.
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Old 03-01-2011, 03:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodswalker View Post
The 2 sporting goods stores near me that sell guns & ammo don't carry 7.62x39 . Makes me think the 7.62 is only popular/common with the survivalist crowd .
since 308 is 7.62x51 how can you say that its only popular amongst the survivalist crowd?


and i find 7.62x39 anytime i check the shelves
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Old 03-02-2011, 12:39 PM
andersed andersed is offline
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I would debate the point that more whitetail have been taken with a 30-30 than any other caliber. i believe that title is still held by the 44-40.
Back to .30 cal cartridges. I believe in the 30-06. M2 AP is very underloaded for the 30-06 case. You can reload it for a bolt gun and it turns a lot of things into concealment. It can take everything on the NA continent.
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Old 07-06-2011, 08:26 PM
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Currently my .30 cal rifle is a M1903A3 Springfield which was manufactured in 1943. Not exactly museum quality (that's how I prefer a historic rifle, meant to be SHOT, not hung on a wall) but a shooter. Deadly accurate, even without a scope, the A3 has peep sights similar to those of the M1 Garand and the later M14/M16 rifles, still pretty much used today, accurate out to long range, and was known as one of the most accurate rifles ever made.

Mauser style bolt action is to this day widely used, as is the .30-06, which can take down virtually anything in North America. Because it's a bolt gun all the energy of the round is used to propel it rather than work a semi-automatic action (this is one reason why most sniper rifles are still bolt action).

Of course it's disadvantage is it's bolt action, which effectively makes it a one shot deal in a fast action situation, putting you at a disadvantage vs a semi auto. Good news is it's so accurate you aren't likely to NEED another shot It also can hold only a maximum of 5 rounds.

What I WANT though is a M1 Garand or a M1A. Can't afford either yet. .30-06 is my preferred round because of it's versatility, both for hunting (again, it can kill any game you would want killed) as well as for self defense (anyone you have to hit with it is not only likely to die but they will be knocked BACK in the process, something a .223 or 5.56 can't do).

The M1 style rifle won World War II. It is tough, extremely reliable (arguably as reliable as an AK), deadly accurate, and represents the state of the art insofar as a battle style rifle that is legal for civilian ownership.
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Old 07-06-2011, 09:09 PM
JWJ78 JWJ78 is offline
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Kev should put the 7.62x54R on there too, lots of people have Mosin's.
I have an SKS and will likely be getting a Mosin Nagant too, mainly because of cost and it's cheap to shoot, however ideally I'd go with the 308. Ruger's new GSR has everything I want in a survival rifle, once I have a new job I will have one!
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Old 07-06-2011, 09:13 PM
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Add me to to the 7.62 x 51 / .308 fans that would chose it first. All of them are good, but if I had to pick only one, it would be 7.62 x 51 out of a good M1a variant.
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Old 07-07-2011, 07:42 AM
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Based on the terrain where I live which is mostly suburban, lots of hills and an abundance of large trees I would be lucky to find a spot where I could get a 200m line of sight. I would pick an AK/7.62x39, all the range I would need and good availablity.
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Old 07-07-2011, 08:38 AM
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I pick the 308. Have owned quite a few different guns and calibers thru the years and my current Howa 20in HB in 308 is just a tack driver.

I don't plan any shootouts, but would rather try to keep zoombies at a distance...lol

My 12 ga will handle any up close and personal work.

Good thread.

Jimmy
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Old 07-07-2011, 02:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MojaveGreen View Post
Knowing your objective is one side to the decision of which round is best. But in a SHTF scenario versatility is what made me decide on the M1A platform. I may not have the choice on what distance to defend myself, or choice in what animal is available. So to say this round for this situation, and that round for that situation might have more to do with luxury of choice. The M1A might not be a better choice over a bolt rifle on the 1000 yard target, it might be a little slower than the lighter platforms for target acquisition and sight alignment, but it can still do everything all the others can do. Usually there is some restriction, but with the M1A it's the do all choice.
Well put sir. Instead of having a large tool box full of different rifles chambered for different calibers, using parts, and magazines that wont interchange between them, I have concentrated my efforts to become as proficient as possible with one design using one caliber, and they also share parts, mags, and cleaning equipment.

I put alot of emphasis on other supporting equipment too boot... IE..... load out equipment/ load bearing equipment. ( Spending most of my adult life in the Infantry has shown me that this is just as important when the plan calls for any type of movement, regardless of terrain and distances involved )
All my gear looks like mis matched surplus junk compared to alot of brand spankin new vests and other LBE I see lots of on the net, but all of mine have already been put to the test in all types of climates, terrain, seasonal shifts, and weather. (Example: I know how much more it weighs and how it "wears" while soaking wet or frozen solid, and what happens to it when it all dries out.)
The point directly pertaining to this thread = this same LBE can support any one of my rifles without having to swap out for different magazines. I also know it inside and out, so no need to waste time with setting it up for any different weapons, and all time available to get as proficient with it and one type of magazine.

My choice = 7.62x51mm/308. My main reason for this as a choice stems from past and current experiences during combat operations for country, and hunting experiences for "relaxation"....so to speak.
Point blank ranges on out to my own maximum effective range, and in any kind of weather/terrain, day or night.

My avatar = M1A-A1 and M14S

I wanted the "rule of 3's pertaining to the primary rifle, so here is my recent addition.....


LRB Arms M14SA

All 3 are built along similar lines, overall balance is the same, and they also share the same spare parts, magazines, and cleaning equipment.
Optics mounts vary depending on the optic, and all of them sport the well designed Garand rear sight assembly. ( They are literally the same, except mine are graduated in meters where as the M1 = yards.)

Note: While a bolt rifle might "out last" my choice, I am not all that convinced of it. Examples: More moving parts may in therory add up to more things that can go wrong, but if I close the spindle valve and use it, then those parts just aint moving.
Mine are all built with parts designed to hold up in the worst situations, select fire use, and launching muzzle mounted rifle "munitions". I'm certain they will do well for semiautomatic use in surviving.

Note: My issued rifle is also of the same flavor.

Note: All of um can fall victim to O'le murphy at anytime. Thats what a sidearm is for however, so time is allocated for this. The 10-22 is a "training aide" for the most part, but it has other uses as well.

I hunt, train, and fight with my choice, and honestly do not require a big tool box full of different center fire rifles for any perceived necessity. Any I do have fall into the "secondary lineup, and can be used to fill in niche roles or as handouts. Ie...... I dont need um...just like um.

The M14 = both



11B
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Old 07-07-2011, 04:28 PM
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For me it would have to be a light weight CRF bolt action .308win.
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Old 07-08-2011, 08:48 PM
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I like the .30-30, and its ballistic twin, the 7.62x39 for most shooting tasks here in the Ozarks. The .308, and its ballistic twin, the 7.62x54R, are pretty good medicine for the plains country. I shoot the 8x57 because I have spare barrels, spare tooling, and a ****load of ammunition.
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Old 07-08-2011, 10:39 PM
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SAIGA .308 with muzzle brake or another AK variant in 308 (there is another??)
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Old 07-10-2011, 01:33 PM
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30-06 for me. I can use as light as 55 grain bullets in it. I also already have a couple of other rifles that use the same parent case. 25-06 and 280.
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Old 07-10-2011, 01:48 PM
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great choice Kev on the DS arms FAL. I want to shoot the new SIG 716.

the 308 wins with its greater enegry ,penetration and range over lesser rounds. It wins over the 30/06 because its the exact bullet in a half inch shorter case and loses only 80 feet per second in the process.

Nothing you shot with the 308 or the 30/06 would notice the difference but more portable ammo and shorter mags and slightly less ammo weight makes the winner the

308
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Old 07-11-2011, 12:48 AM
Herd Sniper Herd Sniper is offline
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The more I think about it, the more I keep looking at a scoped Arsenal AK type rifle for my future survival needs.
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Old 07-11-2011, 09:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kev View Post
So what is the best 30 caliber survival rifle?



DS Arms SA58 FN-FAL, surefire G2X Pro and Maxpedition Noatak

6 months ago I would have said either the 7.62X39 in the SKS / AK-47 or a lever action rifle in 30-30. Both rounds have low recoil, so just about everyone in the family should be able to shoot them fairly well.

Now that I had the chance to hold and shoot an FN/FAL, there is no real comparison, the FAL with the larger 308 Winchester wins.

But the FN/FAL is just my personal preference – the PRT-91 and the Springfield M1A are both excellent military grade weapons, that should give years of service and should be just as reliable as the FN/FAL.

The 2 things the SKS and AK47 have going for them – weight and cost of ammo. Compared to the FN/FAL, the AK47 is super lightweight, with the SKS being a little more heavy then the AK-47.
DSA makes a helluva FN FAL. I've got a buddy down in Atlanta that's got a safe full of them. He's a retired Colonel who, over the course of his career (beginning with him being a Plt Ldr for me in the early 80s) has had plenty of opportunity to shoot just about anything and everything the world has to offer in the way of MBRs. I wish I would not have missed out on the Embel kit craze a decade ago. I completely let it slip by. Of course, I know that comparing an Embel kit FN FAL to a DSA Arms FN FAL is like comparing a WASR to an Arsenal AK.

Funny thing is that whenever I go down there, or he comes up here, to shoot, we always end-up fawning over the other's rifles. My M14s and M1as and his FN FALs. That's the crazy thing about us gun nuts when it comes to our MBRs I guess. We're a little more sentimental about our bolties and leverguns I think.

How are you fixed for mags for that stick? Have you had any issues finding good ones that are not overpriced? I know that Thermomold is making one locally here, literally a few miles from where I am setting, that my buddy has tried and he likes them a lot. I think Palmetto State Armory is their local distributor, or Ellett Bros, I'm not sure but I know they seem to be a great value for the buck for FN FAL owners from what I gather. Maybe it's Ellett Brothers because I think he actually bought his DSA metric steel mags from Palmetto State Armory when we were over there last time.
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