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Old 05-28-2020, 08:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Watchingtheweasels View Post
"Us" for Mississippi Wolf is the "Church of Christ", a 100 year old protestant denomination that began in the United States in the late 1800s. It grew out of the Campbell-Stone restoration movement. Their distinctives that separate them from other protestant denominations used to be that they didn't allow instruments in church and emphasized baptism as required for salvation. They claim that they are the restored Church of Jesus Christ.

Eventually, this denomination split into the mainstream Church of Christ and the International Church of Christ. I'm not sure which specific one he's associated with, but I suspect the latter.

They typically try and use their denominational name as a tool to claim that they are the real thing as he is doing above. He's not here as an inquirer about church history, he's here as an apologist for his organization.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intern...rist_relations
Many moons ago I went to a CoC church service. they sing Christmas carols in the summer time if i recall correctly. ( Christmas on Dec 25th isn't in the bible )

I've heard a former CoC minister, now converted to the Catholic faith describe it as "sola scriptura squared"


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Old 05-28-2020, 09:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Mississippi Wolf View Post
what year or relative century did the church go from meeting together daily to once or twice a week?
It really depends on how you define "the church" of course.

The Church is actually the Body of Christ, so, it can be said that a family which prays together over dinner every night, is "meeting together" as they by themselves are "a church" as the Body of Christ, gathered to meet together over a meal.

What does it matter, it is the real question. Believers are to be the Heart and Hands of Christ every single day and in every situation, so they are the Body of Christ, acting for Him, every minute of every day-- is that enough, apparently not, but it is all we can do for Him, until we all meet on the golden streets together on bended knee singing Alleluia together! Then we can "meet together daily" for all Eternity!
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Old 05-29-2020, 12:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Mississippi Wolf
It's been two days now. I'm waiting for a response concerning the actual language of the text.
I don't always check SB and then don't always respond right away. Sometimes a response requires serious thought and study to get the correct information and words compiled in a way that it is easily understood. Such is the case here. Additionally I don't ever just take someones word for an interpretation of Scripture. Even my Pastor's words and interpretation. I always read and study for myself. And see if it make sense with other Scripture.

This is a rather long post but necessary to get the info across.

When interpreting any verse or passage of Scripture, one should always first interpret the verse literally (unless it is obviously figurative), then in the context of the author's passage, considering the time and situation in which it was written and is it consistent with other passages in Scripture on the same subject (compare Scripture with Scripture) In the case of baptism and salvation, the Bible is clear that salvation is by grace through faith in Jesus Christ, not by works of any kind, including baptism. There are many verses that support salvation by grace thru faith. So, any interpretation which comes to the conclusion that baptism, or any other act, is necessary for salvation, is a faulty interpretation. This will be seen in the following.

Now specifically
Quote:
Act 2:38* Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.*
For Baptism to be required for salvation one would have to believe that in this verse the word "for" means “in order to get.”

However, in both Greek and English, there are many possible usages/definitions of the word “for.”

For instance in the sentence Take two aspirin for you headache. The word for means "because" not "in order to get".

Thayer's Greek Definitions states that the Greek word “eis” can mean 1) into, unto, to, towards, for, among. No argument there.

In Acts 2:38 the Greek word “eis” is translaterd “for”. What does the English word “for”mean.
Webster's 1828 dictionary contains the type of English used in the 1611 KJV and the revised version in 1881 so I have selected 4 out of the 31 definitions contained therein for the word for.
7. In advantage of; for the sake of; on account of; that is, towards, noting use, benefit or purpose.
14. Because; on account of; by reason of. He cried out for anguish. I cannot go for want of time. For this cause, I cannot believe the report.
17. In quest of; in order to obtain; as, to search for arguments; to recur to antiquity for examples.
22. With a view to obtain; in order to possess. He writes for money, or for fame; that is, towards meeting, or to have in return, as a reward.

“For” can mean all of the above in 2:38.

However, "eis" can be translated other than for. One example of how "eis" is used in other Scripture is
In
Quote:
Mat 12:41* The men of Nineveh shall rise in judgment with this generation, and shall condemn it: because they repented at the preaching of Jonas; and, behold, a greater than Jonas is here.
*The word eis is translated "at" and communicates the “result” of an action. "At" was not part of Thayer's definition.

In this case it is said that the people of Nineveh “repented at the preaching of Jonah” not in order to get the preaching of Jonah.. Clearly, the meaning of this passage is that they repented “because of’” or “as the result of” Jonah’s preaching.
In the same way, it would be possible that Acts 2:38 is indeed communicating the fact that they were to be baptized “as the result of” or “because” they already had believed and in doing so had already received forgiveness of their sins

In Peter’s next two sermons to unbelievers in Acts 3:17-26 and Acts 4:8-12 he associates the forgiveness of sins with the act of repentance and faith in Christ without even mentioning baptism. So if Baptism was required, it would seem that Peter would have mentioned it.

In addition to Acts 2:38 there are three other verses where the Greek word eis is used in conjunction with the word “baptize” or “baptism.” The first of these is
Quote:
Mat 3:11* I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire:
*, In this verse "eis" is translated "unto" meaning to. Clearly the Greek word eis cannot mean “in order to get” in this passage. They were not baptized “in order to get repentance,” but were “baptized because they had repented.”

The second passage is
Quote:
Rom 6:3* Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
*
Again the word eis is translated unto or to. This again fits with the meaning “because of” or in "regard to." not in order to get. Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized “in order to get” Jesus Christ were baptized “in order to get “his death? Nooooo!

The third and final passage is
Quote:
1Co 10:2* And were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea;
* Again eis is translated unto or to. Again, eis cannot mean “in order to get” in this passage because the Israelites were not baptized in order to get Moses to be their leader, but because he was their leader and had led them out of Egypt.
If you are consistent with the way the preposition eis is used in conjunction with baptism, you will conclude that Acts 2:38 is indeed referring to their being baptized “because” they had received forgiveness of their sins.

Some other verses where the Greek preposition eis does not mean “in order to obtain” are Matthew 28:19; 1 Peter 3:21; Acts 19:3; 1 Corinthians 1:15; and 12:13.

The grammatical evidence surrounding this verse and the preposition eis favor the best possible definition of the word “for” in this context is either “because of” or “in regard to” and not “in order to get.” Acts 2:38, when interpreted correctly, does not teach that baptism is required for salvation.

There is another grammatical aspect of this verse to carefully consider—the change between the second person and third person between the verbs and pronouns in the passage. Just like in English grammar, plural verbs must agree with plural nouns and pronouns and the same for singular verbs and nouns and pronouns.

For example, in Peter’s commands to repent and be baptized the Greek verb translated “repent” is in the second person plural while the verb “be baptized,” is in the third person singular. When we couple this with the fact that the pronoun “your” in the phrase “forgiveness of your sins” is also second person plural, we see an important distinction being made that helps us understand this passage.

The result of this change from second person plural to third person singular and back would seem to connect the phrase “forgiveness of your sins” directly with the command to “repent.”

Therefore, when you take into account the change in person and plurality, essentially what you have is “You (plural) repent for the forgiveness of your (plural) sins, and let each one (singular) of you be baptized (singular).” Or, to put it in a more distinct way: “You all repent for the forgiveness of all of your sins, and let each one of you be baptized.”

There is an important difference between a condition of salvation and a requirement for salvation. The Bible is clear that belief is both a condition and a requirement, but the same cannot be said for baptism. The Bible does not say that if a man is not baptized then he will not be saved. But it does say that for believe.

In Acts 10:43, Peter tells Cornelius that “through His name everyone who believes in Him receives forgiveness of sins” (please note that nothing at this point has been mentioned about being baptized, yet Peter connects believing in Christ with the act of receiving forgiveness for sins). The next thing that happens is, having believed Peter’s message about Christ, the “Holy Spirit fell upon all those who were listening to the message” (Acts 10:44). It is only after they had believed, and therefore received forgiveness of their sins and the gift of the Holy Spirit, that Cornelius and his household were baptized. This is not an exception in Scripture. Baptism is not mentioned as a requirement for salvation whereas Faith is always mentioned.
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Old 05-29-2020, 05:57 PM
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Originally Posted by pinkerpv View Post
Quote:
Originally posted by Mississippi Wolf
It's been two days now. I'm waiting for a response concerning the actual language of the text.
I don't always check SB and then don't always respond right away. Sometimes a response requires serious thought and study to get the correct information and words compiled in a way that it is easily understood. Such is the case here. Additionally I don't ever just take someones word for an interpretation of Scripture. Even my Pastor's words and interpretation. I always read and study for myself. And see if it make sense with other Scripture.

This is a rather long post but necessary to get the info across.

When interpreting any verse or passage of Scripture, one should always first interpret the verse literally (unless it is obviously figurative), then in the context of the author's passage, considering the time and situation in which it was written and is it consistent with other passages in Scripture on the same subject (compare Scripture with Scripture) In the case of baptism and salvation, the Bible is clear that salvation is by grace through faith in Jesus Christ, not by works of any kind, including baptism. There are many verses that support salvation by grace thru faith. So, any interpretation which comes to the conclusion that baptism, or any other act, is necessary for salvation, is a faulty interpretation. This will be seen in the following.

Now specifically
Quote:
Act 2:38* Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.*
For Baptism to be required for salvation one would have to believe that in this verse the word "for" means “in order to get.”

However, in both Greek and English, there are many possible usages/definitions of the word “for.”

For instance in the sentence Take two aspirin for you headache. The word for means "because" not "in order to get".

Thayer's Greek Definitions states that the Greek word “eis” can mean 1) into, unto, to, towards, for, among. No argument there.

In Acts 2:38 the Greek word “eis” is translaterd “for”. What does the English word “for”mean.
Webster's 1828 dictionary contains the type of English used in the 1611 KJV and the revised version in 1881 so I have selected 4 out of the 31 definitions contained therein for the word for.
7. In advantage of; for the sake of; on account of; that is, towards, noting use, benefit or purpose.
14. Because; on account of; by reason of. He cried out for anguish. I cannot go for want of time. For this cause, I cannot believe the report.
17. In quest of; in order to obtain; as, to search for arguments; to recur to antiquity for examples.
22. With a view to obtain; in order to possess. He writes for money, or for fame; that is, towards meeting, or to have in return, as a reward.

“For” can mean all of the above in 2:38.

However, "eis" can be translated other than for. One example of how "eis" is used in other Scripture is
In
Quote:
Mat 12:41* The men of Nineveh shall rise in judgment with this generation, and shall condemn it: because they repented at the preaching of Jonas; and, behold, a greater than Jonas is here.
*The word eis is translated "at" and communicates the “result” of an action. "At" was not part of Thayer's definition.

In this case it is said that the people of Nineveh “repented at the preaching of Jonah” not in order to get the preaching of Jonah.. Clearly, the meaning of this passage is that they repented “because of’” or “as the result of” Jonah’s preaching.
In the same way, it would be possible that Acts 2:38 is indeed communicating the fact that they were to be baptized “as the result of” or “because” they already had believed and in doing so had already received forgiveness of their sins

In Peter’s next two sermons to unbelievers in Acts 3:17-26 and Acts 4:8-12 he associates the forgiveness of sins with the act of repentance and faith in Christ without even mentioning baptism. So if Baptism was required, it would seem that Peter would have mentioned it.

In addition to Acts 2:38 there are three other verses where the Greek word eis is used in conjunction with the word “baptize” or “baptism.” The first of these is
Quote:
Mat 3:11* I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire:
*, In this verse "eis" is translated "unto" meaning to. Clearly the Greek word eis cannot mean “in order to get” in this passage. They were not baptized “in order to get repentance,” but were “baptized because they had repented.”

The second passage is
Quote:
Rom 6:3* Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
*
Again the word eis is translated unto or to. This again fits with the meaning “because of” or in "regard to." not in order to get. Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized “in order to get” Jesus Christ were baptized “in order to get “his death? Nooooo!

The third and final passage is
Quote:
1Co 10:2* And were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea;
* Again eis is translated unto or to. Again, eis cannot mean “in order to get” in this passage because the Israelites were not baptized in order to get Moses to be their leader, but because he was their leader and had led them out of Egypt.
If you are consistent with the way the preposition eis is used in conjunction with baptism, you will conclude that Acts 2:38 is indeed referring to their being baptized “because” they had received forgiveness of their sins.

Some other verses where the Greek preposition eis does not mean “in order to obtain” are Matthew 28:19; 1 Peter 3:21; Acts 19:3; 1 Corinthians 1:15; and 12:13.

The grammatical evidence surrounding this verse and the preposition eis favor the best possible definition of the word “for” in this context is either “because of” or “in regard to” and not “in order to get.” Acts 2:38, when interpreted correctly, does not teach that baptism is required for salvation.

There is another grammatical aspect of this verse to carefully consider—the change between the second person and third person between the verbs and pronouns in the passage. Just like in English grammar, plural verbs must agree with plural nouns and pronouns and the same for singular verbs and nouns and pronouns.

For example, in Peter’s commands to repent and be baptized the Greek verb translated “repent” is in the second person plural while the verb “be baptized,” is in the third person singular. When we couple this with the fact that the pronoun “your” in the phrase “forgiveness of your sins” is also second person plural, we see an important distinction being made that helps us understand this passage.

The result of this change from second person plural to third person singular and back would seem to connect the phrase “forgiveness of your sins” directly with the command to “repent.”

Therefore, when you take into account the change in person and plurality, essentially what you have is “You (plural) repent for the forgiveness of your (plural) sins, and let each one (singular) of you be baptized (singular).” Or, to put it in a more distinct way: “You all repent for the forgiveness of all of your sins, and let each one of you be baptized.”

There is an important difference between a condition of salvation and a requirement for salvation. The Bible is clear that belief is both a condition and a requirement, but the same cannot be said for baptism. The Bible does not say that if a man is not baptized then he will not be saved. But it does say that for believe.

In Acts 10:43, Peter tells Cornelius that “through His name everyone who believes in Him receives forgiveness of sins” (please note that nothing at this point has been mentioned about being baptized, yet Peter connects believing in Christ with the act of receiving forgiveness for sins). The next thing that happens is, having believed Peter’s message about Christ, the “Holy Spirit fell upon all those who were listening to the message” (Acts 10:44). It is only after they had believed, and therefore received forgiveness of their sins and the gift of the Holy Spirit, that Cornelius and his household were baptized. This is not an exception in Scripture. Baptism is not mentioned as a requirement for salvation whereas Faith is always mentioned.
First, You started out by taking the approach it cannot meam xyz because i don't believe that. That was your first problem. Thats called eisegesis. It means you read into a text what you want it to say not what it says. It means you had a conclusion before you began. That is a failure from the start and you cannot arrive at truth that way.

Second. What about baptism is your work? Do you believe baptism is your work? If so you have completely missed baptism and who is doing what in that moment.
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Old 05-29-2020, 06:46 PM
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Mississippi Wolf;

Of course I started out with the premise that baptism is not required for salvation. That is what I believe the Scripture says. And then I posted the
Scripture and reasons why. Read the Scripture and do the research yourself concerning what I posted. And come to your own conclusion.

Quote:
Second. What about baptism is your work? Do you believe baptism is your work? If so you have completely missed baptism and who is doing what in that moment.
I don't understand what you are asking here. My work? Are you asking if I consider baptism to be a work? Anything a person does for salvation outside of believing (otherwise having faith) that Jesus Christ is God's son and died on the cross for the sins of the world and his/her sins specificaly, was buried and resurrected could be considered a work.

There are many Scriptures that make this clear. They have been posted many times.
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Old 05-29-2020, 07:56 PM
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Originally Posted by pinkerpv View Post
Mississippi Wolf;

Of course I started out with the premise that baptism is not required for salvation. That is what I believe the Scripture says. And then I posted the
Scripture and reasons why. Read the Scripture and do the research yourself concerning what I posted. And come to your own conclusion.

Quote:
Second. What about baptism is your work? Do you believe baptism is your work? If so you have completely missed baptism and who is doing what in that moment.
I don't understand what you are asking here. My work? Are you asking if I consider baptism to be a work? Anything a person does for salvation outside of believing (otherwise having faith) that Jesus Christ is God's son and died on the cross for the sins of the world and his/her sins specificaly, was buried and resurrected could be considered a work.

There are many Scriptures that make this clear. They have been posted many times.
Let's start here. Was Paul saved on the road to Damascus or after?
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Old 05-30-2020, 09:27 AM
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Originally Posted by Mississippi Wolf View Post
To be a citizen of the kingdom and body of Christ the scriptures are clear. The protestants have subtracted baptism and repentance from it while Catholicism and Orthodoxy have added only by a succession bishop to it.

Mark 16:16 (KJV 1900): 16*He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.

Who shall be saved?

Acts 2:38 (KJV 1900): Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost

Do what in order to have forgiveness of sins?

Romans 6:3–4 (KJV 1900): Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death? 4*Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.

What are we baptized into?

1 Peter 3:20–21 (KJV 1900): Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water. 21*The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:

What happens at baptism?


Didache
But let no one eat or drink of your Thanksgiving (Eucharist), but they who have been baptized into the name of the Lord; for concerning this also the Lord has said, Give not that which is holy to the dogs. Matthew 7:6

Those who are not baptized are those outside of the body and unable to take communion. That is clear. Not in fellowship with God or the church.


The monarchal system came along later and established their own sets of rules of who can perform it( only them of course) how long you have to wait. How long did the Eunuch wait again? Jailer? Lydia? People on pentacost? Oh the same day, same hour. Not months? No. Only they can give it communion and you must take it from them. More things not found before the 200s.

If I were to describe what i see today. Id say the Protestants are the sadducese who deny many teachings of inspiration and the Catholics/ Orthodox are the pharisees who have taken man made tradition and added them to the teachings of Christ and the Apostles as though they are mandated teachings of God.

However Orthodoxy and I seem to be finding out Catholicism both teach baptism for remission of sins ans entrance into the kingdom. Protestants however do not sadly. However they also baptize infants which makes no sense and achieves nothing but deception.
I meant to come back to this earlier but forgot to. Why do you believe that protestants don't do baptism? Im not sure what your exposure to protestants is but every denomination I have looked at do it and believe that it is required.
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Old 05-30-2020, 12:13 PM
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I know my posts can be long as i try to put in clarifying information that will make my posts easier to understand and follow to those that may not have done a great deal of study on the subject or disagree. And as a result many may not read the entire post.

There are some great posters on this forum, several with whom I don't agree with on many topics. They provide much background on the reason for their answers. And we have great discussions on the topics of which we don't agree.

I am not going to play twenty questions with any of them and not with Mississippi Wolf either. If you want to have a discussion about your doctrinal point then provide justification and/or scriptural evidence for your interpretation or show why other interpretations are incorrect, again using Scriptural justification.
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Old 05-30-2020, 05:06 PM
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I know my posts can be long as i try to put in clarifying information that will make my posts easier to understand and follow to those that may not have done a great deal of study on the subject or disagree. And as a result many may not read the entire post.

There are some great posters on this forum, several with whom I don't agree with on many topics. They provide much background on the reason for their answers. And we have great discussions on the topics of which we don't agree.

I am not going to play twenty questions with any of them and not with Mississippi Wolf either. If you want to have a discussion about your doctrinal point then provide justification and/or scriptural evidence for your interpretation or show why other interpretations are incorrect, again using Scriptural justification.
It's 3 questions. You can answer 3 questions.
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Old 05-30-2020, 08:51 PM
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So is there any historical evidence for the church of Christ denomination existing in the early church?

I assume they used Luther's canon just like they do today correct?
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Old 05-31-2020, 09:44 AM
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So is there any historical evidence for the church of Christ denomination existing in the early church?

I assume they used Luther's canon just like they do today correct?
My mothers family was involved in a "Church of Christ" denomination for many, many years.

They were the non-musical instrument, no hair cuts for females, one cup communion, baptism is required to be saved types.

They have 4-5 pet doctrines that "they" believe separate them from all other Christian believers. These groups break off each other nearly constantly over the smallest issue.

IMHO this particular COC group is a toxic cult who's worship is aimed inwardly who spend the vast majority of their worship in celebration of themselves rather than God. The group (Church) becomes the object of worship and praise. Their leaders have become holy and worthy of great admiration rather than Christ. It's where they went wrong.
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Old 05-31-2020, 04:54 PM
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no hair cuts for females
Never heard that one before.
I wonder where that belief comes from.
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Old 05-31-2020, 11:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Sloth View Post
So is there any historical evidence for the church of Christ denomination existing in the early church?

I assume they used Luther's canon just like they do today correct?
My mothers family was involved in a "Church of Christ" denomination for many, many years.

They were the non-musical instrument, no hair cuts for females, one cup communion, baptism is required to be saved types.

They have 4-5 pet doctrines that "they" believe separate them from all other Christian believers. These groups break off each other nearly constantly over the smallest issue.

IMHO this particular COC group is a toxic cult who's worship is aimed inwardly who spend the vast majority of their worship in celebration of themselves rather than God. The group (Church) becomes the object of worship and praise. Their leaders have become holy and worthy of great admiration rather than Christ. It's where they went wrong.
Never heard of such a thing except among the pentacostals
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Old 06-01-2020, 12:04 AM
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So is there any historical evidence for the church of Christ denomination existing in the early church?

I assume they used Luther's canon just like they do today correct?
I'm not sure what you are speaking of. I'm sure some churches of Christ are denominated and use the name as a title rather than a description. The orthodox church and catholic church both refers to themselves this way.

http://orthodoxinfo.com/general/pomaz_church.aspx

"In the New Testament, this name has an incomparably deeper and more mystical meaning which is difficult to embrace in a short verbal formula. The character of the Church of Christ is best explained by the Biblical images to which the Church is likened"
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Old 06-01-2020, 12:11 PM
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Never heard that one before.
I wonder where that belief comes from.
(Church of Christ) They get it from (Corinthians 11:15) that "if a woman has long hair, it is a glory to her, for her hair is given to her for a covering."

They believe a woman's hair must be UNCUT forever because of this verse. Believe me they have written 50 page booklets on this one verse explaining why this means "Un-CUT" forever.

They have 4-6 doctrines they believe separate them from everyone else and have crowned themselves "THE TRUE & ONLY CHURCH" because of these teachings. They spend most of their time teaching and preaching on their wonderful selves and how they alone stand against all the false churches and teachings etc.

The worship and praise is all focused inward rather to God alone.
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Old 06-01-2020, 12:20 PM
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Never heard of such a thing except among the pentacostals
Within the Alexander Campbell movement (which splintered in ten thousand different directions) there is dozens and dozens of different doctrines they all claim separate them from one another.

Most believe they were restoring the Church to the 1st century Church (as if that is the model) and became hyper-sensitive over the slightest disagreement.
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Old 06-01-2020, 12:21 PM
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One thing I heard, and do not care to google, is that the CoC has the baptismal open 365/7/24
That is a great thing if true.....but

This thread has had the Baptism pinp-pong ball bouncing back and forth

I am of the "If you call on the name of the Lord" camp
You receive eternal life and are Born Again
No water Baptism needed to be Saved
It took Jesus over 30 years to get water Baptized

I agree with water baptism as a general matter as a public declaration of faith

I would stake my life on this:
No denomination is even close to perfect
And
There are zero denominations in Heaven
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Old 06-01-2020, 12:34 PM
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One thing I heard, and do not care to google, is that the CoC has the baptismal open 365/7/24
That is a great thing if true.....but
It's just not true in my Mother's old COC

If you received Christ as Savior, then accepted and acknowledged all the COC doctrines and renounced your old false Church as heathens, then your baptism/salvation would be scheduled on the next available date.

Just pray you didn't die while waiting 1-8 weeks it took to have the approved baptizer to come and baptize/save you.

I recall having a cousin telling me that he will finally get SAVED October 14th when the minister gets there.

That's how pathetic, unbiblical and backward this COC is.
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Old 06-01-2020, 12:41 PM
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Thank you for the first hand knowkedge
Hear the Word and be saved
Super-simple as God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit intended

The notion that you have to do anything other than accept Jesus as your Lord and Savior to be Saved
Immediately
Is something I do not agree with

The personal and singular decision to accept Jesus as you Lord and Savior is all it takes
Any obstacles put in the way of the direct path to Salvation are of satan
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Old 06-01-2020, 03:28 PM
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Thank you for the first hand knowkedge
Hear the Word and be saved
Super-simple as God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit intended

The notion that you have to do anything other than accept Jesus as your Lord and Savior to be Saved
Immediately
Is something I do not agree with

The personal and singular decision to accept Jesus as you Lord and Savior is all it takes
Any obstacles put in the way of the direct path to Salvation are of satan
Agreed!

It's why I have such an issue over many Churches who place themselves in the path to salvation and even a Christ pleasing Christian life.

None of which is taught or even hinted to in God's word. God's word is the ONLY thing that protects us against from greedy evil churches. No wonder we were warned over and over again about wolves in sheep clothing and false teachers.
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