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Old 01-22-2020, 08:00 AM
saln saln is offline
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Default Latest Water Threat: PFAS's, Cancerous "Forever Chemicals"



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Been reading, seems only GAC and RO are "somewhat effective" against these contaminants.

Everything I look at seems "wishy washy" on specs, not to mention cheap, ass plastic crap. Anyone have a line on verifiable, quality products that will make this trip, Zeke, ya out there?

https://www.yahoo.com/news/u-drinkin...050229550.html
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Old 01-22-2020, 08:18 AM
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Interesting topic. You know that detection levels have gotten very low, parts per billion isn't uncommon, only a few years back parts per million were hard to detect and before that it was non-detect.

Damage can be caused by a single exposure of certain amount of something or it may take many years of lots of the stuff to cause damage.

I think RO and activated charcoal is the best water you can get. Drinking distilled water is hard on the kidneys IMHO, you need to add back some clean minerals.
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Old 01-22-2020, 08:22 AM
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Originally Posted by charliemeyer007 View Post
Interesting topic. You know that detection levels have gotten very low, parts per billion isn't uncommon, only a few years back parts per million were hard to detect and before that it was non-detect.

Damage can be caused by a single exposure of certain amount of something or it may take many years of lots of the stuff to cause damage.

I think RO and activated charcoal is the best water you can get. Drinking distilled water is hard on the kidneys IMHO, you need to add back some clean minerals.
From what I have been able to discover, this group of particular contaminants are measured in parts per trillion. If they are getting down to those numbers, it cant be good...
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Old 01-22-2020, 08:36 AM
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https://www.safeopedia.com/definitio...r-trillion-ppt

1 second in 32,000 years isn't much.

You get exposure from eating and breathing besides drinking.

How many neutrinos are passing threw your body every second?
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Old 01-22-2020, 09:25 AM
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Originally Posted by charliemeyer007 View Post
https://www.safeopedia.com/definitio...r-trillion-ppt

1 second in 32,000 years isn't much.

You get exposure from eating and breathing besides drinking.

How many neutrinos are passing threw your body every second?
Ya, I get that. All I'm saying is if they need to measure it down to that infinitesimal amount, the damage it causes must be pretty dam bad.
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Old 01-22-2020, 10:40 AM
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If its in firefighter foam then no point in me worrying 'bout it any more. Some of the guys thought it even made good soap for truck washing...

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Old 01-22-2020, 11:15 AM
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Need to measure or can be measured? How pure is your carbon, what about the membranes in the RO system? When will we be able to test to one atom per mole, 1 in 6.022 x 10^23 atoms.

How many radioactive C 14 atoms are in your body now? Then there all those other isotopes of hydrogen, oxygen, nitrogen, and iodine, chlorine....
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Old 01-22-2020, 11:58 AM
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Originally Posted by charliemeyer007 View Post
Need to measure or can be measured? How pure is your carbon, what about the membranes in the RO system? When will we be able to test to one atom per mole, 1 in 6.022 x 10^23 atoms.

How many radioactive C 14 atoms are in your body now? Then there all those other isotopes of hydrogen, oxygen, nitrogen, and iodine, chlorine....
Like I said, I get your point. I don't however understand how protecting, for less contaminants, is a bad thing.
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Old 01-22-2020, 04:09 PM
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If its in firefighter foam then no point in me worrying 'bout it any more. Some of the guys thought it even made good soap for truck washing...

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A foam DOES is great for washing. As DAWN dish soap. Cl B perhaps not.
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Old 01-22-2020, 04:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by saln View Post
Been reading, seems only GAC and RO are "somewhat effective" against these contaminants.

Everything I look at seems "wishy washy" on specs, not to mention cheap, ass plastic crap. Anyone have a line on verifiable, quality products that will make this trip, Zeke, ya out there?

https://www.yahoo.com/news/u-drinkin...050229550.html
Yahoo quoting "Environmental Working Group (EWG)". That's some reliable info. Wikipedia and Huffpo not available?
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Old 01-22-2020, 04:44 PM
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Like I said, I get your point. I don't however understand how protecting, for less contaminants, is a bad thing.
Have the risks at PPT concentrations even been characterized and peer-reviewed? I'm betting they haven't. Eventually, you reach the point of diminishing returns where the benefits don't justify the costs. You're just sinking more and more money into chasing some arbitrary "zero".

Every reputable source I have seen still says no definitive link has been found. Lawyers, politicians, and activists loooooooooooove cancer claims because they're always based on statistics that can be easily manipulated for effect.

This PFAS craze has also hit the fire protection industry pretty hard in some areas. Now, anytime these departments have to put out a car fire, it becomes a hazardous materials incident if they use AFFF foam. Yep, let's take effective tools away from firefighters because the enviro-left is crying wolf again. I'm sure that won't lead to any unintended consequences.
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Old 01-22-2020, 05:45 PM
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On one hand I'm always leery of fluoridated chemicals because of their robust persistence.

In the other hand this chasing parts per trillion is a bit absurd.

For these chemicals I like bone char. For household use I suggest giving Highwater Filters a call so you can talk with them about your kitchen faucet setup. They have a few options to put a bone char cartridge in your cold water supply line under the sink. The owners were very active members at SB in the past and will make a good effort to look after your needs. The same cartridge is also good for arsenic, chlorine, and fluoride.
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Old 01-22-2020, 07:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CONELRAD View Post

This PFAS craze has also hit the fire protection industry pretty hard in some areas. Now, anytime these departments have to put out a car fire, it becomes a hazardous materials incident if they use AFFF foam. Yep, let's take effective tools away from firefighters because the enviro-left is crying wolf again. I'm sure that won't lead to any unintended consequences.
... well, just use Halon, oh wait never mjnd...

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Old 01-22-2020, 08:06 PM
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... well, just use Halon, oh wait never mjnd...

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Id bet my job that water kills more people each year than that and PFAS put together... actually better not say that too loud. Someone might propose a ban on dihydrogen monoxide next.
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Old 01-22-2020, 08:38 PM
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Id bet my job that water kills more people each year than that and PFAS put together... actually better not say that too loud. Someone might propose a ban on dihydrogen monoxide next.
Hydrogen hydroxide. You inorganics...

Funny, I was thinking they would probably ban use of water under the clean water act or something...

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Old 01-22-2020, 11:32 PM
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Originally Posted by CONELRAD
I’d bet my job that water kills more people

I thought he said water bills kill, and I thought, that's the freekin' truth.
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Old 01-22-2020, 11:48 PM
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I'm thankful I am on well water, with a couple of filters before it pours out my faucet.


.......
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Old 01-23-2020, 08:40 AM
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I'm thankful I am on well water, with a couple of filters before it pours out my faucet.


.......
Screw-on kitchen faucet carbon filters are just too cheap and too easy these days.

True, fancier inline whole house cartridge systems work better, but people can get some level of toxin deterrence immediately for $30, a pair of pliers and a half hour in the kitchen.
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Old 01-23-2020, 09:30 AM
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Dump enough of it into the ground for long enough and you get to be business of the year.

https://www.mlive.com/news/2020/01/m...-the-year.html
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Old 01-23-2020, 11:20 AM
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I had my well tested 30 years ago. The lab said it contained a carcinogen, but the level is so low, a person would have to drink 300 gals per day for 300 years in order to get cancer.
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