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Old 11-22-2019, 09:09 PM
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I haven't seen this discussed much on the boards. Everyone seems to think their fellow man will be the most dangerous animal post-SHTF but what about feral dog packs? They're already a threat in India where 12 children were killed over a one year period near one Indian town:
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...-a8339576.html

Post-SHTF many people will probably let the family pet roam free if they don't have the food to feed it. Will these strays become food for humans or will they form dangerous packs?
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Old 11-22-2019, 09:21 PM
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I suspect they will try to survive any way they can. As soon as a few of their pack mates are shot, they will be scarce at the sight of people. Not many yotes or wolves attack people for a reason.

After the dogs, it will be the bugs.
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Old 11-22-2019, 09:22 PM
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Both probably. It depends..
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Old 11-22-2019, 09:43 PM
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The one place that I had to deal with feral dogs was California outside 29 palms. Two of the packs knew what a human with a gun was.
The last ones were going down the middle of the road in front of the house made a 90degree turn coming across the for my 2 year old daughter. I split that SOBs’ head with a shovel.
I’ve found the remains of domestic dogs curled up under bushes because there’s no wild left in them someone dumps them in the countryside and they sit down and wait for them to come back to get them.

I saw a documentary about successful street dogs in the third world, they average 35 lbs
Short coats, and brown.

So the large breeds will only be around a couple generations.

But then there’s this
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.dai...HIHUAHUAS.html
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Old 11-23-2019, 07:00 AM
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Feral dogs are definitely something to think about. I've had to deal with lots of them getting into my farm animals

Best thing to do is shoot them dead

I've not had any try to come after me, generally I hear of pets attacking people not feral dogs but being in the right place at the right time, anything can happen

I would imagine though that after some apocalyptic event, they're more likely to become dinner!
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Old 11-23-2019, 08:34 AM
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Feral dogs kill pregnant woman on a a hunt
Sad ending

https://www.france24.com/en/20191122...z-forest-death
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Old 11-24-2019, 08:37 PM
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Thanks to OP and commenters

This strikes me one of the big zompoc issues that could go either way-- either dogs could become a big problem, or something as simple as people killing them for food could nip it in the bud.

My own model for what it could be like (if it does end up being a problem) is from the Planet Earth nature documentary series, for a view of what pre-domestication dog life must have been like. On the show, there were wild dogs in Africa called hunting dogs, and they run down prey as a pack. I was impressed.

Also, I'm just thinking of stories I've heard every once in a while about wild dogs becoming prolific someplace. You really can't take the tameness of dogs for granted. It's one of the many normal things that will be off the rails once it's the EOTWAWKI.

However, I just think a comment I read once that treated it as a certainty that dogs will be a big problem was going a little far. It's true that there are plenty of dogs around, but I just think dogs aren't that formidable-- the apocalypse that will be killing all the people off, will also be killing the dogs off. If a die-off is going gradually at all, then it will be an obvious idea to plenty of people to kill dogs for food. If dogs are left behind in homes, then I don't really see them escaping on their own. I've never heard of dogs breaking through windows.

On the other hand, a power-off situation could lead to a lot more people spending time with their windows and doors open, to try to keep cool... but I just don't think it's necessarily that straightforward that, once we're grid down, WROL, EOTW, whatever, you end up with a sci-fi pack of two dozen vicious, killer dogs before long.

If you want to use history, the rest of the world, the Third World, the natural world, whatever, as your guidepost.... isn't there plenty of evidence there for either theory? There are plenty of places where wild dog packs are a problem, and plenty of places where they're not, right?

We'll just have to wait and see.
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Old 11-24-2019, 09:18 PM
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I was attacked at night by a pack of feral dogs, whilst camping on a beach in Northern Greece. This was back in 2015.
I ended up having to kill a Sarplaninac that was intent on eating me. No gun, but fortunately I was prepared & carrying a CS Bushman bowie.

A couple of years later in 2017, a British woman was killed by a pack of dogs & partially eaten less than a mile from where my attack happened. The Greeks blamed wolves, in order to protect their tourist industry, but there are few if not no wolves in that area, as the shepherds don't use dogs to protect their sheep.

As we all know, Greece has been in trouble for years now & if you're struggling to feed your family, most people will just let their dogs fend for themselves & this is just what they've done. It will be the same during a SHTF event anywhere in the world & believe me, it's not something that you want to face at 2 in the morning, especially without a firearm!
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Old 11-24-2019, 10:16 PM
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In India, the practice of ahimsa limits the killing of animals. We have no such compulsion.
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Old 11-24-2019, 11:30 PM
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I've dealt with a pack of feral dogs. Shoot 1 or 2 and they run. But keep shooting because if they get hungry enough they will return another day.
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Old 11-24-2019, 11:55 PM
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This is interesting. Of course now we have firearms to kill canines and I doubt wolves would make much of a comeback unless it's TEOTWAWKI or a multi-year grid down situation but wild dog packs could wreak similar mayhem:

https://retrieverman.net/2010/10/27/...lves-of-paris/
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Old 11-25-2019, 12:34 PM
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Out here most ranchers will shoot roaming dogs on sight.
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Old 11-25-2019, 12:54 PM
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If you can see them you can shoot them. If you can't, you can hang a piece of meat on a fish hook 3 feet off the ground.
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Old 11-25-2019, 02:55 PM
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Oddly, in most armed societies, feral dogs, wolves and other predators are not a big problem.
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Old 11-25-2019, 03:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swamppapa View Post
Iíve found the remains of domestic dogs curled up under bushes because thereís no wild left in them someone dumps them in the countryside and they sit down and wait for them to come back to get them.
That's a good point.

Another massive-yet-popularly-overlooked problem we've mentioned a little on the boards is all the corpses, though.

There will be plenty lying around for homeless dogs to feed off of!

And what about the spread of coyotes. It's like pendulum has swung back, from around 100 years ago, and the period right before the rise of hunting laws, to a point now where everything's learned how to live with humanity right up next to them. Coyotes, foxes, boars, you name it. There are plenty of animals around now.
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Old 11-25-2019, 03:18 PM
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As the late Mechanix Illustrated Tom Macahill stated. “ A chihuahua is a headache that got loose.
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Old 11-25-2019, 09:03 PM
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Here we shoot'em, gut'em and hang'em on the barbed wire fence to use as coyote bait. A .22-250 with 55-grain Sierra Blitz or Hornady SX with 38 grains of H380 does the job in one shot, no matter where it hit's'em. No riccochets, no exits. Leaves 10-20 pounds of gurgling bone frags and bloody jam in a leather bag.
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Old 11-25-2019, 09:21 PM
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Maybe some here have had experiences with dogs that are easily intimidated by loud noises, but on the other hand, I know for a fact that the sound of loud gunshots (even if it puts a few dogs down) will not slow down highly motivated dogs. It has been noted that with some dog packs, most of them need to be killed before the rest run away. Of course, results vary according to whatever is motivating the pack action.

If anyone has ever seen how fast and furious a dog pack can be, you may want more than a gun for protection, which might not have enough deterrent power against a large pack of dogs.

Can you picture yourself in this video, and see yourself fumbling with a speed loader?


This particular woman was fortunate that the pack was deterred by a loud noise, but not all packs are this easily deterred. The point of this video that a more determined pack could have easily overwhelmed her.

If I had to face a pack of motivated dogs I would want something in addition to a gun for closeup work. Of course a gun can be handy, but unless I had a machine gun (lol!), I would want to also have additional backup if I am attacked by animals from multiple angles at once.

For example, in some situations, I may be able to sweep through a pack with a large knife or heavy bat and inflict serious deterrent pain better than ONE bullet at a time which requires aiming at multiple moving targets in a very short time frame.

Watch how this woman braced herself against the light pole to keep from being pulled down again. What also helped is the thick winter clothing that she wore. If she was attacked in this manner in the summertime, those teeth would have easily ripped skin and muscle through thin clothing, and this video would have had an entirely different outcome.

Many historical accounts show that dog packs will be some of our worst nightmares during and after SHTF events. It only takes a day or two for dog packs to form.

Now, imagine all those dogs that will be turned loose by owners who think their pets will be able to find food on their own during a severe SHTF event. Or the owners flee (or die), leaving their animals behind (we've all seen this in the news, again and again).

Also, consider that not all domestic dogs are indoor lapdogs; many are large and powerful animals that can quickly turn into a pack of efficient killing machines, which is why prepping for this eventuality is important to me.
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Old 11-26-2019, 01:06 AM
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Small dogs will be a valuable resource post SHTF. Most were bred as ratters and in an agrarian society they will be worth their weight in gold. Much of a dog's behavior is instinctive, so once humans stop using them as pets, the next generations will be working animals as they were for all but the last few hundred years. Large dogs like pit bulls, shepherds and Dobermans won't be much good immediately after the Crash, but as breeding stock, they'll be producing the next generation of guard dogs. Once nutty AKC breeding standards are ignored, these dogs will start to show the traits they were bred for.
Consider the value of a good ratter if you have to get rid of a rat infestation in your grain store. If you have to work in the fields from sunup to sundown, a good big guard dog that takes up its post at sundown to protect your crops and stock will be valuable. My grandpa had a big mixed breed shepherd that would head off to guard the stock whenever it saw him coming in from the fields in the evenings. In the mornings, as my grandpa was headed out to work the farm, the dog would come home, eat his bowl of scraps and Dog Chow, and snooze the day away under the back porch.
And when the stupid squirrels, rabbits and other small game has been killed, the guy with the best hunting dog will be the guy with meat for the stew pot.
Dogs are instinctive pack animals, but as long as they are removed from the litter soon enough, humans become their pack. If stray dog packs become a problem, the best countermeasure will be your dogs.
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Old 11-26-2019, 01:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GrizzlyetteAdams View Post
Maybe some here have had experiences with dogs that are easily intimidated by loud noises, but on the other hand, I know for a fact that the sound of loud gunshots (even if it puts a few dogs down) will not slow down highly motivated dogs. It has been noted that with some dog packs, most of them need to be killed before the rest run away. Of course, results vary according to whatever is motivating the pack action.

If anyone has ever seen how fast and furious a dog pack can be, you may want more than a gun for protection, which might not have enough deterrent power against a large pack of dogs.

Can you picture yourself in this video, and see yourself fumbling with a speed loader?

Damn Pack Of Savage Stray Dogs Attack A Defenseless Woman In The Middle Of The Street! World Star - YouTube

This particular woman was fortunate that the pack was deterred by a loud noise, but not all packs are this easily deterred. The point of this video that with a more determined pack could have easily overwhelmed her.

If I were faced with a pack of dogs I would want something in addition to a gun for closeup work. Of course a gun can be handy, but unless I had a machine gun (lol!), I would want to also have additional backup if I am attacked by animals from multiple angles at once.

For example, in some situations, I may be able to sweep through a pack with a large knife or heavy bat and inflict serious deterrent pain better than ONE bullet at a time which requires aiming at multiple moving targets in a very short time frame.

Watch how this woman braced herself against the light pole to keep from being pulled down again. What also helped is the thick winter clothing that she wore. If she was attacked in this manner in the summertime, those teeth would have easily ripped skin and muscle through thin clothing, and this video would have had an entirely different outcome.

Many historical accounts show that dog packs will be some of our worst nightmares during and after SHTF events. It only takes a day or two for dog packs to form.

Now, imagine all those dogs that will be turned loose by owners who think their pets will be able to find food on their own during a severe SHTF event. Or the owners flee (or die), leaving their animals behind (we've all seen this in the news, again and again).

Also, consider that not all domestic dogs are indoor lapdogs; many are large and powerful animals that can quickly turn into a pack of efficient killing machines, which is why prepping for this eventuality is important to me.
Thanks, Grizzlyette. Especially you and Chops249 were really helpful here. And what a video. That's really just about all one needs, by itself.

I thought the problem over more after posting, and concluded the same thing as you about letting dogs loose, too. One would more tend to expect that people would let them loose instead of killing them. They'd only kill them if they were pretty sure they were in a pretty hard position of impending starvation.

Anything less than pretty good certainty of that, and they'd tend to stop short of the most extreme decisions.

Probably what's going to have to happen is government's going to have to be kind of on the ball, and put an announcement out that people should not let their dogs loose, and provide a euthanasia service.
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