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Old 05-03-2016, 07:27 PM
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I'm sure some of you have noticed that chinamart currently has 50rd boxes of perfecta 223 for $14 and some change for a rollback. At that price I figured what the heck and bought a couple hundred rounds. Seems to shoot decent enough but I'm wondering how close this ammo really is to m193 5.56 nato. It says 223 Remington on the box but it is 55gr fmj and the brass is visibly annealed like mil surp, also it has a crimped primer pocket. I'm guessing maybe mil spec brass loaded to 223 pressures? Possibly a thicker copper jacket? It's distributed by tulammo but made in Italy by fiocchi. Anyone have any experience here or compared it with m193?
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Old 05-03-2016, 08:38 PM
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From what I understand, all Perfecta ammunition is made to russian military specs, just like Wolf, Silver Bear, Tulammo, Red Army Standard, WPA...and all the other "brands" that are really just bullets made in the same Russian arsenal, Tulsky Oruzheiny Zavod, and marketed in different packages.

I use Perfecta in my 9mm's, my SXD .45 and my kid uses it in her HiPoint .40 Carbine to blast around at targets. If you watch our YouTube vids, it's what we use predominantly. It functions flawlessly, burns clean, and is accurate as I can demand of it.

As to whether or not it's milspec, I would suspect that it's the same actual bullets you'd find in steel cases from Wolf or Tula (if you're familiar with those brands), so yes, it's essentially a military ball round. Ballistically, there should be little or no difference.
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Old 05-03-2016, 09:08 PM
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Not so, if you read the box it says made in Italy, distributed by tulammo. Now the only major ammo manufacturer in Italy is fiocchi. I have pulled bullets from 9mm, .45acp, and the 223 and they are identical to the fiocchi branded boxes right down to jacket thickness on the 45. It is not Russian made and it is not a bi metal jacket found in wolf and Tula. The box dimensions are even the same as fiocchi just branded different.
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Old 05-03-2016, 09:17 PM
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Originally Posted by KHos View Post
Not so, if you read the box it says made in Italy, distributed by tulammo. Now the only major ammo manufacturer in Italy is fiocchi. I have pulled bullets from 9mm, .45acp, and the 223 and they are identical to the fiocchi branded boxes right down to jacket thickness on the 45. It is not Russian made and it is not a bi metal jacket found in wolf and Tula. The box dimensions are even the same as fiocchi just branded different.
I stand down, a corrected man then. I've found it to perform equal to milsurp, in every way, but then again, as I said, I only use their handgun-caliber fmj rounds.

How did Russia get into distributing Italian made ammo? It's not like Russia don't already control 25% of the world's ammunition production anyway.
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Old 05-03-2016, 09:45 PM
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After looking unsuccessfully for the last few weeks,today I finally stumbled onto some perfecta .38 at one of my local Walmarts. They also finally had some of the 9mm, but I didn't need it, so i called a buddy so he could swing by and scarf it up.
The .38 ammo was only $14.74 per box of 50, which is pretty damned good for first-world, reloadable brass-cased stuff.
I've shot perfecta in .223,45acp,9mm,and 357, and sometime soon, this .38 special. Both me and my best shooting bud have fouind it to be solid stuff, especially at these prices.
And, to address the above comments on the bullets being the same as in Russian ammo, i don;t think this is correct. Most of the russian stuff uses a bi-metal jacket, that looks very copper-colored. This perfecta has a shiny brass-colored jacket. I've never seen that color on any Russian bullet.
edit: to answer the OP, I only shot 1 box of the perfecta .223, in a CZ 527, and I thought the stuff was pretty sloppy. This CZ bolt gun, with Bushnell 4200 Elite scope, normally shoots like a damned laser, but i wasn;t getting that with this .223 ammo.
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Old 05-03-2016, 09:53 PM
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I will echo the above regarding their 9mm. Wally World used to see Brass Maxx 9mm at about $23/100 but that seems to have gone away. I have since been buying the Perfecta and it performs just as well. Clean burning, accurate, brass, and cheap. Not a whole lot else you can ask for.
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Old 05-04-2016, 04:56 AM
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GlAIlO4ahIA

Perfecta is essentially re branded Fiocchi and is not mil spec ammo.
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Old 05-04-2016, 10:02 AM
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I knew it was fiocchi but the annealed brass and crimped primer got me thinking as that's 2 requirements for military contracted ammo.
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Old 05-04-2016, 10:33 AM
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i have never had any issues with fiocchi in any caliber... i wouldnt hesitate to shoot it, but price point would determine if i would actually buy it.
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Old 05-04-2016, 10:37 AM
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Fiocchi USA is literally a few miles from me. So why can't I ever find Fiocchi ammo at the local wally world ? Hardly any of the prefecta either.

Can't find much much fiocchi at the local fun shops either for that matter.
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Old 05-04-2016, 01:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KHos View Post
I knew it was fiocchi but the annealed brass and crimped primer got me thinking as that's 2 requirements for military contracted ammo.
Military 9mm is 124gr +P
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Old 05-04-2016, 04:36 PM
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I really wouldnt worry about the microscopic differences that may or may not exist. What Id be concentrating on is stocking up on as much ammo as possible no matter what grain bullet crimped or not primer. When you start talking tiny tiny differences it reminds me of a young kid I work with who the other day announced to the world how inexperienced he truly was by saying that since I dont have a climate controlled special room to reload ammo in that Id be hsving misfires left and right. I quickly shut him up by saying Id been reloading for 27 years without the bs he described. Good not to be a gun slob and good not to be a gun snob and now back to gettin ready for civil war bring it on!
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Old 05-04-2016, 04:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mattgunguy View Post
Fiocchi USA is literally a few miles from me. So why can't I ever find Fiocchi ammo at the local wally world ? Hardly any of the prefecta either.

Can't find much much fiocchi at the local fun shops either for that matter.
They've only been producing ammo in the US for a relatively short period of time if I am thinking of the right company. I don't know if they make all calibers both here and in Italy, but it seems to be feast or famine sometimes. When ammo was scarce after Sandy Hook, a local shop was still carrying Fiocchi at pre-panic prices and continued to do so for quite some time. Even now, with most calibers readily available, some online sellers make a big deal about getting more Fiocchi in stock. I like their ammo myself (use Fiocchi Extrema XTP 9mm as carry ammo) and buy it frequently, but sometimes it disappears for long periods of time. Same with Armscor for some reason, which it imported as well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lt. Drake
How did Russia get into distributing Italian made ammo? It's not like Russia don't already control 25% of the world's ammunition production anyway.
Tula and Wolf don't actually produce anything to my knowledge. They're simply importers and marketers, so any number of factories may be producing "their" ammo at any given time. Sort of like Cold Steel, which is just a brand name and not an actual knife manufacturer.
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Old 05-04-2016, 05:07 PM
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Also, as a side note about "mil-spec" ammo, I wouldn't expect something like Perfect .223 (or any other brand) to fragment like 5.56 M193 does, even if the appearance and performance are the same in all other regards. For some folks, that's a major consideration. Personally, I buy whatever is cheapest (brass, not steel) for range use, but if I'm at all on the fence about a gun or scope's accuracy, it has to at least get combat-accurate results with M193 of some brand or other.
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Old 05-04-2016, 05:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KHos View Post
I'm sure some of you have noticed that chinamart currently has 50rd boxes of perfecta 223 for $14 and some change for a rollback. At that price I figured what the heck and bought a couple hundred rounds. Seems to shoot decent enough but I'm wondering how close this ammo really is to m193 5.56 nato. It says 223 Remington on the box but it is 55gr fmj and the brass is visibly annealed like mil surp, also it has a crimped primer pocket. I'm guessing maybe mil spec brass loaded to 223 pressures? Possibly a thicker copper jacket? It's distributed by tulammo but made in Italy by fiocchi. Anyone have any experience here or compared it with m193?
I realize that some like it and have had good experiences with that kind of stuff.

I will simply say that you will never see it running through anything I own that is not Soviet.

I only run Premium gasoline in my cars as well.
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Old 05-04-2016, 05:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rc508abn View Post
Military 9mm is 124gr +P
I'm talking about their .223 hence the title of the thread.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Audacious Frog View Post
I realize that some like it and have had good experiences with that kind of stuff.

I will simply say that you will never see it running through anything I own that is not Soviet.

I only run Premium gasoline in my cars as well.
Why? I'm not talking about steel cased Tula or wolf. This is brass cased ammo made by fiocchi that has good quality annealed brass that I have already reloaded. Do you not use fiocchi ammo in your firearms for some reason? They are one of the oldest manufacturers in the world, been cranking out munitions since 1876. I'd say they're right up there with premium brands.
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Old 05-04-2016, 06:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KHos View Post
I'm talking about their .223 hence the title of the thread.

.
LMAO, that was supposed to go on an entirely different board
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Old 05-04-2016, 06:32 PM
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It happens man. Lol
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Old 05-04-2016, 06:41 PM
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If it is Fiocchi, it's good stuff. I used to like using Fiocchi 125gr 357 in my wheel gun. Also clean, accurate and loaded pretty damn hot for off the shelf ammo.


Back to your regularly scheduled thread.
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Old 05-04-2016, 07:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KHos View Post
I'm talking about their .223 hence the title of the thread.



Why? I'm not talking about steel cased Tula or wolf. This is brass cased ammo made by fiocchi that has good quality annealed brass that I have already reloaded. Do you not use fiocchi ammo in your firearms for some reason? They are one of the oldest manufacturers in the world, been cranking out munitions since 1876. I'd say they're right up there with premium brands.
Ummm. Because I am an ammo snob and not ashamed of that. Same goes for gasoline and parts.

I will add that I have not been in a Marty Mart in over 10 yrs and have no desire to break my streak.

Fiocchi is "OK" and I have shot it on occasion. No real grumbles to offer other than it tends to run hot. S&B is OK thought it tends to run hot as well.

MY own personal view is this. Russian ammo in Russian guns. Chinese ammo for landfill.

If you shoot it and like it, more power to you. I am not about to choose your GF for you either.
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