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Old 07-23-2009, 01:30 AM
BladeGuru BladeGuru is offline
 
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Default Krav Maga WTF????



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Look guys I know Krav is relatively new for most people. It seems exotic as opposed to run of the mill arts like karate, etc.

Some people get off on the hybrid aspect where they took the basics of karate and jiu jitsu and gun disarms and wrapped it all into one jewish looking package.

And yes, I get the 'survivalist link' in that they all are former members of the Israeli Defense Force, etc. Yeah I get it.

But look guys lets put this in perspective. Most of you all in this forum are the first to say that if a gun hasnt been fired you've done something wrong, i.e. look to the gun first.

These guys are military they shoot guns all day in an urban setting.

The palestinians they fight arent notorious hand to hand combat experts nor are they experts in military fighting tactics. they are terrorists who car bomb things.

So the Israelis winning a war with superior firepower, courtesy of the US/Jewish Lobby, doesnt make as much of a crucible for a fighting system as you might think.

These guys are totally untested in battlefield warfare. Apart from skirmishes with Jordan and Syria over the years we have seen little. Israel doesnt send its sodiers on UN Peacekeeping missions.

Think back thru all the war stories you've ever heard. Ever heard one about the time Israel rushed a communist bunker in Vietnam?

Don't say yes.

Did they help out in Korea, Grenada, Falklands, Albania, no.

So a system that leans heavily on their historical fighting prowess means nothing.

It MAY stand on its own. But truthfully, it doesnt. I own all the videos. Read all the books. Even met some of them. Krav, Haganah, whatever is big in AZ.

I still dont understand why.

Does it have the same reputation for brutal toughness as Burmese boxing/Krabi Krabong/ Muay Thai? hell no.

What about Kyokushinkai? Is Krav tougher than Kyokushinkai? Heeeeelllll No

Knife fighting? **** no. Zero. What they have is sadly not worth mentioning.

South Korea has a kill ratio in Vietnam of over 25-1. THey sent over 350000 troops to help the US, whose kill ratio wavered between 4 and 6 to 1.

They would encircle Charlie and slowly tighten the noose until what remained was forced into hand to hand or bayonet fighting. What style did they use?

Tae Kwon Do. Tae Kwon Do has killed more people in modern warfare from 1950 to today than any other hand to hand, non weapon, combat art. If you count the Korean war too where EVERYONE knew some TaeKwonDo its an even larger number.

I just wanted to put some historical perspective out there.

I understand they have some neat gun disarms but some thats the extent of their expertise.

At best this is Jewish Kajukenbo but with gun disarms

Bladeguru

PS: Here a good example of a Krav gun defense that is almost perfect. I dont like the idea that it travels across the face as he is 'redirecting'. Other than that hes very savvy about how and when the gun can and often will fire during a scuffle.

Last edited by BladeGuru; 07-23-2009 at 02:58 AM..
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Old 07-23-2009, 01:47 AM
sojurn87 sojurn87 is offline
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So....you don't like Krav Maga?

Even though it's super deadly?

No really....it's super deadly.

I once had a thought about a krav maga move....and it almost killed someone standing next to me.








If there is a video in your post I don't think anyone can see it.....at least I can't.
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Old 07-23-2009, 03:01 AM
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Default Look again.

Man Im so fast.

So fast that you didnt even realize it was already there before you posted.

You have much to learn my young padawan.

In re Krav... you ARE joking right?

BG
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Old 07-23-2009, 04:23 AM
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I agreed with you until you said 'Tae Kwon Do', then I started laughing uncontrollably, falling out of my chair.
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Old 07-23-2009, 09:30 AM
BladeGuru BladeGuru is offline
 
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Default BJJ,

Im sorry but theres a reason ground fighting has a very limited amount of time with our soldiers vis a vis what they learn in h2h.

Its because nobody goes to the ground in a melee of 100 combatants that have guns, knives, etc.

And historically Brazilian Jits has killed absolutely no one in a war. Hell no jits has been used in a war since the Japanese invasion of Manchuria when rifles were still kind of ****ty.

Jits has its place but its a very short time in the continuum of fighting.

BG
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Old 07-23-2009, 11:06 AM
sojurn87 sojurn87 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BladeGuru View Post
Man Im so fast.

So fast that you didnt even realize it was already there before you posted.

You have much to learn my young padawan.

In re Krav... you ARE joking right?

BG
There is no joking in Krav Maga!









Yes I am joking.....

https://www.survivalistboards.com/showthread.php?t=59814

First post.....
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Old 07-23-2009, 11:46 AM
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You can't compare martial arts as to which one is "better". You can only compare fighters.

For example, check YouTube for "Tae Kwon Do vs Muay Thai". In one video you'll see a TKD black belt getting his a** handed to him, in another you'll see MT getting absolutely owned by the TKD fighter.
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Old 07-23-2009, 05:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BladeGuru View Post
Im sorry but theres a reason ground fighting has a very limited amount of time with our soldiers vis a vis what they learn in h2h.

Its because nobody goes to the ground in a melee of 100 combatants that have guns, knives, etc.

And historically Brazilian Jits has killed absolutely no one in a war. Hell no jits has been used in a war since the Japanese invasion of Manchuria when rifles were still kind of ****ty.

Jits has its place but its a very short time in the continuum of fighting.

BG
Yes and that's why I have been practicing/fighting in muay Thai for 11 years.
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Old 07-23-2009, 05:23 PM
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Originally Posted by lockjaw View Post
You can't compare martial arts as to which one is "better". You can only compare fighters.

For example, check YouTube for "Tae Kwon Do vs Muay Thai". In one video you'll see a TKD black belt getting his a** handed to him, in another you'll see MT getting absolutely owned by the TKD fighter.

Please post said videos, because I have seen one that was obviously rigged to make Thai Boxing look bad. It was Korean boxer vs a Korean TKD guy. The Korean boxer look like someone who they pulled off the street, gave 15 minutes instruction and threw him in the ring.
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Old 07-23-2009, 05:33 PM
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Im sorry but theres a reason ground fighting has a very limited amount of time with our soldiers vis a vis what they learn in h2h.

Its because nobody goes to the ground in a melee of 100 combatants that have guns, knives, etc.

BJJ is primarily a sport jujitsu as opposed to traditional Japanese jujitsu. That being said it IS the authority on defense and offense from the ground.

If anything it should be studied at some level just to know how to get back to your feet.

Judo and Japanese JJ are more practical for combat.
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Old 07-23-2009, 05:35 PM
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Muay Thai vs TKD Red Belt


More TKD vs Thai

Thai Gets Jacked

Gracie Black Belt vs TKD Black Belt
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Old 07-23-2009, 05:36 PM
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Originally Posted by lockjaw View Post
You can't compare martial arts as to which one is "better". You can only compare fighters.
I have to disagree with this. It's like saying "you can't compare cars, you can only compare drivers".

A person's dedication in training definitely plays a major roll in their ability to fight well. However the simplicity and brutality of a style plays a larger factor in my opinion.

The KISS principle applies to martial arts as well, and TKD does not pass the test.
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Old 07-23-2009, 05:41 PM
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Originally Posted by BJJ_Grappler View Post
I have to disagree with this. It's like saying "you can't compare cars, you can only compare drivers".

A person's dedication in training definitely plays a major roll in their ability to fight well. However the simplicity and brutality of a style plays a larger factor in my opinion.

The KISS principle applies to martial arts as well, and TKD does not pass the test.
I agree to an extent.

Take your car analogy. If the person driving the lambo can't drive stick, they're going to lose a race to a Pinto. I say this on a very basic level.

Look at the UFC from back in the day, trying to determine which "style" was the best. Now look at how has the sport evolved. There is no one "best" or "toughest" style. It's all about the fighter and how they use those talents. One dimensional fighters don't last very long, regardless of how good they are at that style.

The bottom line is, the more you have in your arsenal, the better.

I definitely agree on the KISS principle.
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Old 07-23-2009, 06:02 PM
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BJJ is primarily a sport jujitsu as opposed to traditional Japanese jujitsu. That being said it IS the authority on defense and offense from the ground.
Wrestling is the authority on offense from the ground. MMA has proven this.
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Old 07-23-2009, 06:09 PM
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Wrestling is the authority on offense from the ground. MMA has proven this.
Provided (typically) the wrestler isn't on his back. MMA has also proven this.
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Old 07-23-2009, 06:13 PM
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Originally Posted by lockjaw View Post

3rd video, this guy is clearly Korean and not Thai, this is the movie I was talking about. Widely regarded as a rigged match.
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Old 07-23-2009, 06:14 PM
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Wrestling is the authority on offense from the ground. MMA has proven this.

No, wrestling is not the authority on the ground.

Wrestling is a co-authority on takedowns and throws along side judo. When it comes to ground work, only catch-as-catch-can wrestling can ATTEMPT to compete with BJJ on the ground.
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Old 07-23-2009, 06:28 PM
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Originally Posted by lockjaw View Post
Provided (typically) the wrestler isn't on his back. MMA has also proven this.
Thats just it, a good wrestler will always have the dominant position. Mount,cross body,back,etc. Thats why a wrestler with no traditional martial arts training(Brock Lesnar) beat a bjj black belt with 20+ years of training(Frank Mir). Frank is an experienced mma fighter and Brock has what 2 or 3 mma fights?

Look at the champ GSP his wrestling takedowns are unstopable,and his wrestling is great, he always gets and holds dominant position. Great stand up also.

Why was Randy Coture so succesfull and a 2 weight class UFC champion? Great wrestling.

To make it in mma you must be a complete fighter wrestling,bjj,judo,muay thai,boxing,conditioning,heart. But put a good wrestler against any one of those arts and the wrestler wins 90% of the time.
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Old 07-23-2009, 06:30 PM
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No, wrestling is not the authority on the ground.

Wrestling is a co-authority on takedowns and throws along side judo. When it comes to ground work, only catch-as-catch-can wrestling can ATTEMPT to compete with BJJ on the ground.
Sorry but im talking mma and you are absolutley wrong on this one.
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Old 07-23-2009, 06:37 PM
Warmachine Warmachine is offline
 
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Originally Posted by BJJ_Grappler View Post
No, wrestling is not the authority on the ground.

Wrestling is a co-authority on takedowns and throws along side judo. When it comes to ground work, only catch-as-catch-can wrestling can ATTEMPT to compete with BJJ on the ground.
How many judo guys can you name that became ufc champs?

I bet i can name more wrestlers who became ufc champs.

A good wreslter with sub defense will beat a bjj guy in mma 99% of the time in mma.
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