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Old 07-13-2019, 10:28 AM
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I can buy stuff, learn stuff and do stuff for prepping but I have a lot of anxiety on who to welcome, who is not welcome and who to invite in the event of a SHTF scenario.

I have a good handful of family around the country who all say "let's go to Uncle Fizbin's place" if something happens. Whereas I'm flattered and can use the personnel for LP/OP's, defense, gardening, livestock, maintenance, and more, a some of these "family members", lazy, have no skills, and worse,,, some have health maintenance issues. Some have as I call it people baggage as well, maybe they are an asset but their spouse would be a liability. Some have like 3 or 4 young kids, some are very old.

How do you tell the baggage people not to come?
An example, I have a son-in-law who is great, but he would need to invite his mom and dad, a sister and her husband and 4 young kids, another sister with her 3 young kids and a twist she and her husband are getting a divorce. Do I tell my daughter and SIL they can come but none or only part of his family?

What do I say about 86 year old granny in a wheel chair and takes like 20 pills a day, coming here? Actually we'd have to send transport about 100 miles round trip to get her.

Then there are the out of state family members who would bring virtually no physical assets or supplies. What do you do or say if they just show up?

Next, I am very very short on personnel. I NEED people just to man watches alone. How do I find these types of folks. I have a couple of employees at work I know would be great, but then again I know they have family baggage. What ideas do you have to grow your compound numbers?

I have started a spreadsheet of all the people I know that would come. I have a column for Skills, Health, Family Baggage, shot distance away for quick arrival, long distance for maybe popping up in weeks or months, and monetary or survival assets.

The only solution I have for this would be to reach out to the folks on my list and ask them what exactly their intentions would be. If they would come for sure I would send them a list of skills that would be needed here. They could choose from the list what they would want to learn and bring to the table.

I'm fortunate enough to have been able to buy tons of near every hard asset needed, but skills and people, I can't do it all.

What other ideas would you have on personnel, I'm sure there are a bunch of things I'm overlooking.
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Old 07-13-2019, 10:49 AM
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Maybe you can work out a deal with "Forged in the Flame".
He is forming a security company.
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Old 07-13-2019, 10:57 AM
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If you're sure they will head your way, be pre-emptive. Give them each a list of supplies that they must bring and stage ahead of time.
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Old 07-13-2019, 11:30 AM
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seems predetermined.

Do what the CIA does, put out ads for people with those skillsets.

However IMO if you are a family person you should be helping your family members train in skillsets that are needed.

Bear in mind most people don't give a damn about SHTF survival as part of their lifestyle.

If you plan on depending on family members you can try to get them to train.

Only really two options there. Train your definite arrivals with skills or find people with those skills.

Also a consideration is not to depend on 1 person with a given skill set. I like to think of it in terms of NASA or a SOF team for a SHTF in that you are going to need to train multiples so that if you loose the person with that skillset you have an alternate to fill that role. Training overlap in skillsets for everyone having every skills is ideal but perhaps not realistic.

Ultimately if you have a self sustaining homestead you can always scale up and try to make it an economic model that allows you to hire people with the skillsets.

Depending on your background and area there are different ins on that. In reality in times of SHTF the main social organization will be religious groups and other community organizations for instance the local masonic lodge.

https://espionagehistoryarchive.com/...sonry-the-cia/

You might want to have a training plan once SHTF does occur so that people can start apprenticing/training in needed skills.
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Old 07-13-2019, 11:39 AM
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I read an article that discussed when all the hordes of friends and relatives show up at your door because they know you prep. Most people arent going to start shooting these people when they show up because most arent heartless animals. The point of the article was to store large amounts of cheap food to give these people when they show up. Yeah if your a hermit with no friends or family you dont have to worry about this but thats rare. Now this could change depending on how long an event had been going on. If your resources were real thin your ties to friends and family might waver but I think if it was early on you would be more generous.
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Old 07-13-2019, 12:39 PM
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Most of us would like to be kind to our relatives. I have some thoughts on how the op might handle a tough call.

Plan A
People do better when they know their limits and expectations. Make plans for specific emergencies.
Be specific on how long they can stay for each situation. Five days, two weeks, a month?
Make sure they know you are not running a free hotel. Have them bring something extra for you.
They bring their own air mattresses/bedding.
Their own food for themselves and their pets for the duration. Make sure pets have crates.
You might invite the son in law with the daughter and give them a room and tell them they may bring anyone they wish that will fit in that one room with them. Great if you have more space.
Make sure every guest has something to do or else they will get on everyone's nerves.
Have morning and evening meetings.
Plan B
If you know ahead of time that it is a long term event then let it be known ahead of time that you cannot take all these people. List it in Plan A. Extended relatives most likely not be insulted if they know you cannot handle a long duration event with them.
As to how to securely get competent people to help you, I cannot answer that part of the equation.
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Old 07-13-2019, 01:40 PM
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If their name is NOT on our roster, they are NOT welcome.
Simple as that.

Be careful who's names are on your roster.
One bad apple can spoil the whole barrel.
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Old 07-13-2019, 03:32 PM
Florida Jean Florida Jean is online now
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So...ignore your preps for a moment.

Make a list [or just think of it] and ask yourself 'Would Cousin Bob take me in if a fire burned down everything [wildfire].' 'Would Uncle Bob even come get me if my car was burned up too?' 'At what point do I think Uncle Bob would tell me to leave? One week? One month? 6 months?....'

If grandma could take me in, [i.e. not in her present situation] would she? Has she? Has she supported/helped/encouraged you in the past? Also, take into consideration she is taking all those pills and you probably won't be able to re-supply them and she won't be with you long anyway. Would you rather have her die in your care; or of neglect and dehydration since workers probably won't show up to take care of her?

Consider your past obligations and inter-actions.

Also, consider many will NOT make it to you because they wouldn't even have enough gas, or know how to find you without gps.

Also, even though SIL invites folks that doesn't mean they will come [or all of them].

Like the food idea. When a group appears, open up a container of rice and beans and starting feeding folks with that. Morning, noon and Supper. [If anyone else there mentions a previous better diet, just say that the short term supplies had been used up]. The most use-less will probably start looking for a FEMA camp and leave.

Further like the 'room' idea if you have the space. Do give the SIL and daughter a room. Ask them to stock it with things they will need to help out with the food bit, but also, so they can have clothing [mention different seasons of the year], shoes, soap, towels, sheets, blankets etc. etc. When the in-laws are mentioned you can look around the room and say 'Well, a triple bunk would probably fit there. And one of those single/double/also sofa units could go there. Umm, I bet they make full sized mattress bunks, maybe that would be better. Trouble with air mattresses is they'd take all the floor space. Ah, a hammock or two? Do you think the kids would like hammocks?"

When you get questions about 'the other bedroom'. Say that is for Grandma [you are presently looking for a manual hospital bed] and Cousin X and his wife and their daughter [who is in college] who will help look after her. And that there needs to be room for the portable commode, wheelchair and such. Besides, you have the closet in that room already stocked full. So it isn't like you could hang hammocks in it like you were thinking of doing with the closet in the room you are offering. [And cover other spaces in the house likewise.]


Yes. And giving them lists of things to bring. Fill up their car space and they will be less likely to bring their neighbors or others. Stuff they think is important; winter coats, clothes, shoes, towels, sheets, pillows, soap, laundry soap....school backpacks and suitcases take up space even before you get to the food and medical stuff, fuel tank from their grill, bicycles in the bike rank on the rear, and if they have ever camped, their tent [to live in], all their camping gear, sleeping bags, fishing poles, gardening tools 'because we're going to have to expand the garden to feed everyone; don't forget the work gloves'.

Now, no one knows how anyone will react in a serious situation. Someone you might think would be wonderful will curl up in a ball and someone who is the worlds greatest whiner and butt sitter will pitch in better than anyone else [though they will probably still whine].

...oh, and when any relatives come by for a visit -- make sure you have them help out in what you think they would not like the most. Shoveling manure. Fixing fences. Digging new ground. Killing and butchering a chicken. Ditto a fish. Cook outside on your grill/fire pit as much as possible. Don't turn on the air conditioning. Heat with wood. Take them shooting/hunting. The more they think about 'things' the less likely they may appear on your doorstep.

Or they might get the idea and ask if they can stock some food at your place. Or pay for pens for rabbits. Or help with a chicken tractor. Perhaps even buy a batch of broilers next year letting you raise them and they'll come help with the butchering and taking a few home.

Maybe one will start shooting at a range near them and get really good.

And do remember, just because the SIL asks, doesn't mean all/any of those relatives will come. The one going through a divorce will probably hook up with someone soon who thinks it is better to stay put/go to his folks place. In fact, it is highly likely that his family will try to get him to stay with them because 'things will get better' -- you need to have that conversation with your daughter about this particularly once she starts having children.
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Old 07-13-2019, 04:04 PM
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Plan an annual family/friends for a big special barbque/etc party. With the good beef/beverages/etc compared to a std get to gether. Pointedly (make it well known) that you invited those you want to have in. Pointedly DON"T invite those who you don't intend to receive at bugout time. The ones that show up with a contribution to the party likely will do the same, within their capability, at bugout time. Throw in a (mandatory) AR15/handgun range funtime experience where you provide the tools/ammo.

Maybe for the 1st party you have a general broadcast invite but judge who shows up with a contribution unprompted.
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Old 07-13-2019, 04:48 PM
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"who to invite in the event of a SHTF scenario"- I guess whoever has the best big screen TV. I didn't know it would be a party.
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Old 07-13-2019, 05:23 PM
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I'm not worried about what people may bring material wise.

Anyone could be useful.

My criteria is not how useful they have proven to be, its how well I can work with them.

I have a hard time getting along with most people.

There are people who could show up with a semi worth of food that I would turn away.

There are others that could show up empty handed and I would welcome them in.

I have seen several organizations destroyed by highly motivated, highly active, highly competant people....with personality problems that made it so everyone else quit.

This week in fact I've been pretty busy trying to salvage the fire department I'm in officer in after a very promising, young, strong, intelligent new member just about brought the whole thing down through personal problems. Some people just can't help treating every group like 'Game of Thrones' and when chastised for a minor mistake activate their whole 'alliance' and three days later half the department is quitting.
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Old 07-14-2019, 01:03 AM
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I moved halfway across the country.

If they know where I live i'm willing to feed them or shoot them.
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Old 07-14-2019, 05:07 AM
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My family is family,each and every one of them are welcome .
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Old 07-14-2019, 05:25 AM
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First rule of the fight club is to never talk about the fight club.

My kids know to come home if anything big happens but they don't know what's in my basement. They know we have always been prepared for things like a long power outage or natural disaster but they don't know the extent of it, nor do they need to know.
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Old 07-14-2019, 08:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aerindel View Post
I'm not worried about what people may bring material wise.

Anyone could be useful.

My criteria is not how useful they have proven to be, its how well I can work with them.

I have a hard time getting along with most people.

There are people who could show up with a semi worth of food that I would turn away.

There are others that could show up empty handed and I would welcome them in.

I have seen several organizations destroyed by highly motivated, highly active, highly competant people....with personality problems that made it so everyone else quit.

This week in fact I've been pretty busy trying to salvage the fire department I'm in officer in after a very promising, young, strong, intelligent new member just about brought the whole thing down through personal problems. Some people just can't help treating every group like 'Game of Thrones' and when chastised for a minor mistake activate their whole 'alliance' and three days later half the department is quitting.


Most of the posts in this thread have a gem or two in it but this one hits it pretty darn close as far as my experience and impressions go.

I am rather well prepared and prepared for a group but also know that personnel problems will be a major problem.

The adjustment from people's normal and relatively luxurious life to one of danger, deprivation and probably crowded conditions will be one many people will not be able to make.

Just about everyone has the potential to be a useful member just like every single one has a potential to be a misfit. Will the difficult times make everyone realize that there are no better choices and have a reasonable amount of cooperation as a result or will it be constant turmoil and open hostility (power struggles).

You likely just won't want to ban or eliminate someone or turn them out to join a raiding party whose members are aware of what you have and your means of defense. Certainly a real dilemma that I've thought of many times.
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Old 07-14-2019, 08:09 AM
mtnairkin mtnairkin is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Florida Jean View Post
So...ignore your preps for a moment.

Make a list [or just think of it] and ask yourself 'Would Cousin Bob take me in if a fire burned down everything [wildfire].' 'Would Uncle Bob even come get me if my car was burned up too?' 'At what point do I think Uncle Bob would tell me to leave? One week? One month? 6 months?....'

If grandma could take me in, [i.e. not in her present situation] would she? Has she? Has she supported/helped/encouraged you in the past? Also, take into consideration she is taking all those pills and you probably won't be able to re-supply them and she won't be with you long anyway. Would you rather have her die in your care; or of neglect and dehydration since workers probably won't show up to take care of her?

Consider your past obligations and inter-actions.

Also, consider many will NOT make it to you because they wouldn't even have enough gas, or know how to find you without gps.

Also, even though SIL invites folks that doesn't mean they will come [or all of them].

Like the food idea. When a group appears, open up a container of rice and beans and starting feeding folks with that. Morning, noon and Supper. [If anyone else there mentions a previous better diet, just say that the short term supplies had been used up]. The most use-less will probably start looking for a FEMA camp and leave.

Further like the 'room' idea if you have the space. Do give the SIL and daughter a room. Ask them to stock it with things they will need to help out with the food bit, but also, so they can have clothing [mention different seasons of the year], shoes, soap, towels, sheets, blankets etc. etc. When the in-laws are mentioned you can look around the room and say 'Well, a triple bunk would probably fit there. And one of those single/double/also sofa units could go there. Umm, I bet they make full sized mattress bunks, maybe that would be better. Trouble with air mattresses is they'd take all the floor space. Ah, a hammock or two? Do you think the kids would like hammocks?"

When you get questions about 'the other bedroom'. Say that is for Grandma [you are presently looking for a manual hospital bed] and Cousin X and his wife and their daughter [who is in college] who will help look after her. And that there needs to be room for the portable commode, wheelchair and such. Besides, you have the closet in that room already stocked full. So it isn't like you could hang hammocks in it like you were thinking of doing with the closet in the room you are offering. [And cover other spaces in the house likewise.]


Yes. And giving them lists of things to bring. Fill up their car space and they will be less likely to bring their neighbors or others. Stuff they think is important; winter coats, clothes, shoes, towels, sheets, pillows, soap, laundry soap....school backpacks and suitcases take up space even before you get to the food and medical stuff, fuel tank from their grill, bicycles in the bike rank on the rear, and if they have ever camped, their tent [to live in], all their camping gear, sleeping bags, fishing poles, gardening tools 'because we're going to have to expand the garden to feed everyone; don't forget the work gloves'.

Now, no one knows how anyone will react in a serious situation. Someone you might think would be wonderful will curl up in a ball and someone who is the worlds greatest whiner and butt sitter will pitch in better than anyone else [though they will probably still whine].

...oh, and when any relatives come by for a visit -- make sure you have them help out in what you think they would not like the most. Shoveling manure. Fixing fences. Digging new ground. Killing and butchering a chicken. Ditto a fish. Cook outside on your grill/fire pit as much as possible. Don't turn on the air conditioning. Heat with wood. Take them shooting/hunting. The more they think about 'things' the less likely they may appear on your doorstep.

Or they might get the idea and ask if they can stock some food at your place. Or pay for pens for rabbits. Or help with a chicken tractor. Perhaps even buy a batch of broilers next year letting you raise them and they'll come help with the butchering and taking a few home.

Maybe one will start shooting at a range near them and get really good.

And do remember, just because the SIL asks, doesn't mean all/any of those relatives will come. The one going through a divorce will probably hook up with someone soon who thinks it is better to stay put/go to his folks place. In fact, it is highly likely that his family will try to get him to stay with them because 'things will get better' -- you need to have that conversation with your daughter about this particularly once she starts having children.


As usual Jean, well thought out and detailed. Now if it only can be made to work.
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Old 07-14-2019, 08:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nomad, 2nd View Post
I moved halfway across the country.

If they know where I live i'm willing to feed them or shoot them.
Geez you sound like my old red neck neighbor. We were discussing a local petty thief, and my old neighbor says, if he shows up here I will gut shoot him and he can pack his own azz off my property.
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Old 07-14-2019, 08:25 AM
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IF IT is TEOTWAWKI event and will be a long term recovery situation to"normalcy" if ever again,
Then no matter how tough, if you want to make it to the end of the tunnel you will have to do a sort of triage. Hospitals and military do it all the time. YOU get to decide who stays and who goes. IT may be tremendously hard, but for the success and health of YOUR group it will be necessary.

Never forget, YOUR house, YOUR supplies, YOUR rules.
You cannot run a survival situation as a democracy. You can ask for and get consensus opinion,
but
there can only be ONE big dog or else you will have folks going off and doing "their own thing" that could be harmful because the right hand will not know what the left hand is doing.

IF we are talking about some event where you can already see the end and return to OK life, then you can be generous Like a massive tornado outbreak wrecks havoc on main lines and several states will be without power for at least 2-3 months. A real pain but it will all get up and running again,
vs
Yellowstone does not completely blow but it is bad enough that the ash cloud has cut the country in half and brought any transportation of goods to a halt. And it will be many month maybe a couple of years before returning to "normal"
vs
Meteor strike in Asia sends dust and dirt into the atmosphere so there will be no crops or agriculture for years to come. The debris coming back down is starting fires all over the planet and pretty much cooking a lot of the world. A true TEOTWAWKI event.

While each requires a somewhat similar response, in reality the long range end is entirely different for each scenario and so who you have is more critical for each one.
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Old 07-14-2019, 08:31 AM
wldwsel wldwsel is offline
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There are some excellent responses here. I would just add the your family needs to be aware of the rules BEFORE they take the first step in your direction. One of those rules is what would be the "crimes" list, plus punishment for them, up to and including banishment.

If a child is banished, one or more parents must go with them. If the other parent and the remaining kids are OK, they should be allowed to stay. Banishment issues would include stealing food or other survival necessities, habitual lying, manipulative behavior, chronic laziness, or anything we consider Capital Crimes today. It may sound harsh to some to banish for the theft of bread because "I was hungry and you don't feed us enough", but in a full blown SHTF scenario, that bread may mean another's life or death.

With all the prepping we do, the one important thing we miss is preparing ourselves for the desperate struggle we will face as 21st century Americans in an early 18th century world. Life will be more than hard.

Having said all the above, I laugh at folks 400 or more miles for here (more than a tank of gas) saying they'll just come here. 90% or more won't make it out of their city. If they aren't prepping enough to feed themselves, they probably have a half tank of fuel, no cash just cards, and not an idea in the world of how to navigate from A to B without GPS, especially tally using back roads because the freeways are a parking lot. If the SHTF was caused by grid down or EMP, they won't even get out of their driveway, much less to my house.

WW

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Old 07-14-2019, 08:48 AM
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Wow, there are a lot of great tips here! I was going to re-quote some of them with comment but there are way to many.

All in all, I think I will basically start a "Manual of Survival". This will include basically all the processes needed to happen here, what is needed, how things will work, rules, followed by a "How would you like to help and fit in?"

Once this is complete, for emphasis I'll print and bind it and mail it in the physical mail. Of course followup with a pdf. It will have another section on best preps they can do to get here with their supplies, maybe a best/safest route map and what they should do if they are bugging-in.

All this with a questionnaire/survey, however it should be phrased, but something they fill out and answer with their thoughts and ideas on how to improve things. This not only will hopefully make them more aware of their own prepping but will tell me their strengths and weaknesses.

Thoughts on this "Manual of Survival"?
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