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Old 05-02-2019, 07:09 AM
benson56 benson56 is offline
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Default Houston to lay off 400 firemen.



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https://www.foxnews.com/us/houston-p...ire-department

So Houston's influx of California refugees is already taking ahold. $197 million budget shortfall.
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Old 05-02-2019, 07:22 AM
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HomeDefense HomeDefense is offline
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So let me get this straight. The city voted for pay raises for firefighters, but didn't vote to increase taxes to pay for it?

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Houston city officials plan to lay off 400 firefighters, or about 10 percent of the department's personnel, to fund pay raises that voters mandated in a November referendum.
How could the increased expense of illegals possibly cause a budget deficit? The Dems keep telling us that immigrants contribute more than they take from society. If that was true, Houston should have a surplus.

Yeah, I know. When we talk about the huge cost of illegal aliens, they respond with statistics about legal immigrants. It's called misdirection.
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Old 05-02-2019, 08:20 AM
Herd Sniper Herd Sniper is offline
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You are watching Houston begin the process of turning into another Detroit, or worse yet, another Chicago. By the time that liberals get done with it, Houston will be a vast wasteland of empty burned out buildings full of illegal immigrants, hookers and drug users. Wait and see.
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Old 05-02-2019, 08:22 AM
InOmaha InOmaha is offline
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That's the easiest way to cut the pension system. It's cheaper in the long run not to have the pension liability and to use better truck technology (many cities are finding this out with park upkeep by buying huge expensive mowers that don't get paid pensions, cost less long term, show up to work everyday, and don't get paid over the winter). It's not like that hasn't gotten better in the centuries since they needed extra people to work the bucket brigade. Around 67% of firemen in the US are volunteers anyway.

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There were an estimated 29,727 fire departments in 2015 (all career: 9 percent; mostly career: 6 percent; mostly volunteer: 18 percent; all volunteer: 67 percent).
House fires continue to decline on average year after year. Changes in eating out instead of home cooking, less smoking, less heating with wood, etc.. Still, cooking accounts for 50 percent of house fires and 30 percent of non-residential fires.

https://www.usfa.fema.gov/data/statistics/

The fire departments spend too much energy responding to non fire calls anyway. They end up at almost every 911 call here, the police and EMS take care of it, and then they go back and wash the truck again.

How are the firemen being used down there? Hurricane evacuations, flood control, EMS, car accidents, ….? Maybe some of those jobs don't need to be done by union members who's main purpose is to keep fires from spreading to nearby structures.

When your house catches on fire, they are showing up to make sure it doesn't spread to other structures. Because if saving your house and possessions were the goal, they wouldn't dump 10s of thousands of gallons of water on them. Everyone I know that had a small house fire put out by the fire department needed to gut the home and rebuild it due to the water damage caused by cutting a hole in the roof and dumping enough water through to fill the basement 4" to 6" deep.

The mayor here just went through a round of union negotiations with the fire fighters. Even though the city budget is typically in the black over the last decade, the fire department and police department are typically over budget and operate in the red.
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Old 05-02-2019, 10:45 AM
WilliamAshley WilliamAshley is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by benson56 View Post
https://www.foxnews.com/us/houston-p...ire-department

So Houston's influx of California refugees is already taking ahold. $197 million budget shortfall.
3600 firefighters is still a lot of manpower.

how many fires does Houston have regularly?

How does the 10% reduction effect their ability to fight fires?


Critically examining the issue though, it doesn't relate to refugees create shortfall. OP is probably just a closet racist.

The city voted to raise firefighters salaries, and as a result has layed off 10% of them due to the salary increases.

Simple math here, if you want to raise city workers incomes you got to raise city taxes. You can't raise salaries and not raise taxes unless you reduce the workforce.

Simple concept.

The addition of some idea of "refugees" from California, to explain a shortfall, actually relates to the city not raising taxes but raising salary levels of city workers.

Your assessment is nonsense.


Also immigration from another US state isn't refugees, the word association game there shows contempt for other Americans of being refugees in their own country. Maybe you didn't notice California is overpopulated.


The sheer implication that 1000 refugees per year relocating to a city of 2 and a half million people is breaking the bank, or that these refugees aren't contributing to the economy in Houston, and are all unemployed is a bit of a stretch.

True a quarter of houstons population was born outside the US but that is not to say that this is new or happened overnight so would not explain how a shortfall happened just this year. Again, closet racism and xenophobia.

I get it. Please look into the growth of the first generation americans in Houston before you say they caused the deficit, look at employment figures for first generation americans. The premise that these people don't work or contribute to the economy is pretty bad. The refugee population is really small. If you can go back 40 years at 1000 per year this gets to the number you are looking for, it does add up but you can't say that this years deficit was caused by refugees. About 1/3rd of the US population is first or second genereation americans. Houston is above average but linking that to a budget shortfall doesn't take into consideration other cities that have budget shortfalls. Take Detroit for example, people were moving out of there in droves.

Now it is true they have higher unemployment rate than non first and second generation Americans but that is because they are still a little alien, have bad English and may hbe employment barriers due to qualifications not directly transferring. Still well over 8 in 10 first and second generation americans are employed contributing to the economy. Stereotyping the majority for a very small minority isn't all that useful.

You are going to need to put down to demonstrate that point.

Even if you were to give all the new refugees for the year $40,000 annual salaries at taxpayer expense that is still 40 million, and that doesn't explain your deficit.

Totally does not reflect the situation in texas to claim handouts by the city are causing a 200 million deficit just pure nonsense

https://www.texastribune.org/2017/12...efits-qualify/
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Old 05-02-2019, 11:22 AM
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What's (if any) are the shortages of police officers in Houston? I saw last year it was around 2,000 short and we're about the same here in Dallas right now.

I thought this was a little disturbing: “I don’t think someone’s citizenship is indicative in any way of someone’s suitability to be a police officer,” said Tom Manger, police chief in Montgomery County, Maryland, a suburb of Washington D.C.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/...ns/2818472002/
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Old 05-02-2019, 12:33 PM
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This is going to bite good ol' Sylvie in the arse next election. Mark my words. That guy is a conman from back in the 80s. Caught back then in a major insurance fraud case involving a fake death.

He's also received significant amounts of 'campaign funds' from very questionable sources, and there is an ongoing expose about that right now.
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Old 05-02-2019, 01:40 PM
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Old 05-02-2019, 03:13 PM
benson56 benson56 is offline
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Of all the fat to be cut in a city that size, they always pick public safety, just to get a rise from the public. I wonder if there's any "non-essential" govt. workers that could be laid off.
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Old 05-02-2019, 03:47 PM
Steve_In_29 Steve_In_29 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by benson56 View Post
Of all the fat to be cut in a city that size, they always pick public safety, just to get a rise from the public. I wonder if there's any "non-essential" govt. workers that could be laid off.
Like the hundreds they could have cut from the welfare office? Who cares if it takes a longer wait for the leeches to get their free money. If they don't like it, then go get a job.
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Old 05-02-2019, 03:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WilliamAshley View Post

Critically examining the issue though, it doesn't relate to refugees create shortfall. OP is probably just a closet racist.

Someone who doesn't like being invaded by criminals does not meant they are racist. To use your own words:

Simple concept.

Your assessment is nonsense.

url]

I hope you never procreate. (Shakes head at the stupid)
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Old 05-02-2019, 04:29 PM
Rural Buckeye Guy Rural Buckeye Guy is offline
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Typical liberal delusions, mistaking fantasies for facts. My brother has worked in Baytown for the last 20 years and had to visit thier facility in SW Houston weekly. Strangely his observations differ from Williams significantly......

William Ashley, what are your first hand observations in Houston these days? Inquiring minds want to know.
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Old 05-02-2019, 04:35 PM
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When your house catches on fire, they are showing up to make sure it doesn't spread to other structures. Because if saving your house and possessions were the goal, they wouldn't dump 10s of thousands of gallons of water on them. Everyone I know that had a small house fire put out by the fire department needed to gut the home and rebuild it due to the water damage caused by cutting a hole in the roof and dumping enough water through to fill the basement 4" to 6" deep.

Meant to quote above ,but it didn’t work out .

That’s one very poor FD then . You open the roof to take heat off the guys inside not spray water in ,and to remove heat, smoke products of combustion, and limit the horizontal spread of the fire, letting it simply vent out of the house . Typically it’s only opened for attic fires ,or well involved second floor ones . A roof hole can be repaired with a sheet of plywood and a bundle of shingles .

You never ever put water into a vent hole , the guys inside will take a beating ,from pushing
The fire down on them ,then you will take a beating .....

Been to a few hundred structure fires, and for us most are one or two roomers and
Put back on the tax rolls . Not uncommon in the hood to have houses that have had 2 or 3 fires in over the years......

Much of the water comes durning overhaul , all burned objects are removed ,along with window and door casings that are charred, walls and ceilings opened up in area of heavy fire, and the engine crews soak the **** out of it . Because one small ember in the wall somewhere can lead to a rekindle a few hours later , and they’re often bigger fires then first one . So take your pick , lots of water or a second fire. I’m ok with the second choice ,overhaul is a lot of work and I like fighting fires .

Sorry for the Houston Brothers .
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Old 05-02-2019, 04:51 PM
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They voted for an innocuous sounding proposition that said the firefighters should be paid the same amount as the police, without figuring out how to pay for it.

Typical democrat maneuver. The bill title sounds good. Idiots vote for it. Then disaster.

Please don't trash talk our firefighters or police. They do a great job most of the time.
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Old 05-02-2019, 05:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by third pig View Post
When your house catches on fire, they are showing up to make sure it doesn't spread to other structures. Because if saving your house and possessions were the goal, they wouldn't dump 10s of thousands of gallons of water on them. Everyone I know that had a small house fire put out by the fire department needed to gut the home and rebuild it due to the water damage caused by cutting a hole in the roof and dumping enough water through to fill the basement 4" to 6" deep.

Meant to quote above ,but it didn’t work out .

That’s one very poor FD then . You open the roof to take heat off the guys inside not spray water in ,and to remove heat, smoke products of combustion, and limit the horizontal spread of the fire, letting it simply vent out of the house . Typically it’s only opened for attic fires ,or well involved second floor ones . A roof hole can be repaired with a sheet of plywood and a bundle of shingles .

You never ever put water into a vent hole , the guys inside will take a beating ,from pushing
The fire down on them ,then you will take a beating .....

Been to a few hundred structure fires, and for us most are one or two roomers and
Put back on the tax rolls . Not uncommon in the hood to have houses that have had 2 or 3 fires in over the years......

Much of the water comes durning overhaul , all burned objects are removed ,along with window and door casings that are charred, walls and ceilings opened up in area of heavy fire, and the engine crews soak the **** out of it . Because one small ember in the wall somewhere can lead to a rekindle a few hours later , and they’re often bigger fires then first one . So take your pick , lots of water or a second fire. I’m ok with the second choice ,overhaul is a lot of work and I like fighting fires .

Sorry for the Houston Brothers .
They may not spray directly in that hole, but the results are the same. Almost every photo of a fire here in the city shows them spraying water top down, with a ladder truck, crews with ladders, someone on the roof, or from the ground level. If your fire is bigger, they are not only spraying from a ladder truck, there will be others spraying through the windows or sides of the burning house. Best case scenario is they contain the fire to a smaller area using a lot of water.

Like I said they're trying to contain the loss to just one house. I don't expect my stuff to make it through a fire. But in the odd chance they are able to put the fire out quickly by flooding my home, I store my important items in water resistant containers in the basement in hopes stuff I want to keep won't be destroyed by the water.

I keep things down there because I also hope it doesn't blow away if we get hit by a tornado.

I really appreciate the fire department when my neighbor has a fire, but the last house fire in my area burned down a 1 million house down to 2 brick walls left standing. And if you walk to the end of the drive you can see the fire station for the area about a half mile away.
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Old 05-02-2019, 05:08 PM
WilliamAshley WilliamAshley is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nomad, 2nd View Post
Someone who doesn't like being invaded by criminals does not meant they are racist. To use your own words:

I hope you never procreate. (Shakes head at the stupid)


I'm sorry but how did we get refugees from California to "criminals"

who exactly are you talking about here.

We've already indicated there is about 1000 new refugees to Houston each calander year, are you implying that refugees are criminals? Where is the evidence of that?

Or are you saying people emigrating from California to Houston who are not refugees are criminals,

or both?

Is there a rise in the crime rate to explain that suddenly there are more people with criminal records in California moving to Houston?

I want to see the evidence.

Not saying it isn't possible just saying you have provided no evidence of that.

I'm not the type of person to bring people into a Shbag world, no worries. I generally am not into acrobatic lovemaking. Yoga is great though, got to get that stretching in. Safety first. Oh right is that the topic?



LOL oh my right the maga talking point any new people to an area must be criminals coming to invade... forgot, but seriously do you really think people who are moving to Houston are all criminals?

Why the hell would you move to Houston to be a criminal, the roads there are terrible to get from job to job. You'd be stuck in traffic for hours just trying to get from one robbery to the next. That is like moving to new Orleans to be a courier driver, who does that? Seriously do some research and share it here. Your talking points are total nonsense.

The crime rate went down by over 4% last year, and the violent crime rate reduced by more than 10% this was with the public safety cuts.

I'd love to hear your version based on scientific values, you know statistics, reports etc.. rather than just BS coming from a fringe right wing movement that lies to distort public policy and sway the uneducated to their banner.

IN fact the gang war going on in Houston right now is GOOD for regular folks cause they are killing each other.
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Old 05-02-2019, 05:23 PM
AZ_HighCountry AZ_HighCountry is offline
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Originally Posted by benson56 View Post
Of all the fat to be cut in a city that size, they always pick public safety, just to get a rise from the public. I wonder if there's any "non-essential" govt. workers that could be laid off.
Phoenix does the same thing. Almost every election threatening to cut police ad fire if this tax isn't passed or that one isn't passed. The voters agree to the taxes, the City still cuts firefighters and police officers, and instead placed urinals and flower pots on some of the sound walls on the local freeways proclaiming it to be *artwork*.

Phoenix is still short of police officers thanks to a 6 year hiring freeze. The City of Philadelphia is smaller and has almost 3X the number of officers. Phoenix has a land mass of 517 sq. miles whereas Philadelphia is about 142 sq. miles. Shootings involving Phoenix police officers are on the rise.
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Old 05-02-2019, 05:28 PM
WilliamAshley WilliamAshley is online now
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Originally Posted by AZ_HighCountry View Post
Phoenix does the same thing. Almost every election threatening to cut police ad fire if this tax isn't passed or that one isn't passed. The voters agree to the taxes, the City still cuts firefighters and police officers, and instead placed urinals and flower pots on some of the sound walls on the local freeways proclaiming it to be *artwork*.

Phoenix is still short of police officers thanks to a 6 year hiring freeze. The City of Philadelphia is smaller and has almost 3X the number of officers. Phoenix has a land mass of 517 sq. miles whereas Philadelphia is about 142 sq. miles. Shootings involving Phoenix police officers are on the rise.

The numbers should be manageable that is about 1 officer per 10 criminals.

If each officer had an investigative caseload of 10 criminals that should be manageable. consider there is also about 1 support worker for every 30 criminals again having 3 officers and 1 support worker per 30 criminals is way better than teacher to student ratios.

The problem is the way policing is being done.

They need more community policing and volunteers from the community assisting policing on a volunteer basis. The model is called "community policing" it is a way better system.

You need to work at building lawful communities not engaging in a never ending wackamole fighting crime methodology.


The privatization of policing and firefighting is a bad thing, you need more community involvement that means active volunteer drivers for volunteer firefighters and volunteer special constables to provide support roles to full time officers.


The division of police and firefighting is also unfortunate as the job training crossover should be easily achieved for front line officers. IF they roled public safety into one force they would reduce duplication and extend capability.
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Old 05-02-2019, 06:05 PM
Steve_In_29 Steve_In_29 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WilliamAshley View Post
The numbers should be manageable that is about 1 officer per 10 criminals.

If each officer had an investigative caseload of 10 criminals that should be manageable. consider there is also about 1 support worker for every 30 criminals again having 3 officers and 1 support worker per 30 criminals is way better than teacher to student ratios.

The problem is the way policing is being done.

They need more community policing and volunteers from the community assisting policing on a volunteer basis. The model is called "community policing" it is a way better system.

You need to work at building lawful communities not engaging in a never ending wackamole fighting crime methodology.


The privatization of policing and firefighting is a bad thing, you need more community involvement that means active volunteer drivers for volunteer firefighters and volunteer special constables to provide support roles to full time officers.


The division of police and firefighting is also unfortunate as the job training crossover should be easily achieved for front line officers. IF they roled public safety into one force they would reduce duplication and extend capability.
This is one of the stupidest things I have ever heard.
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Old 05-02-2019, 06:22 PM
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This is one of the stupidest things I have ever heard.
That is a textbook example of why I quit reading his posts long ago. May just print it out a share with some of my police officer and firefighter buddies. Give the guys and gals who do those jobs for a living to weigh in. And these aren't just beat officers. The ranks include a couple lieutenants and commander types.
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