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-   -   Southern USA- 'Tis the season: snakes (https://www.survivalistboards.com/showthread.php?t=350241)

solinvictus 05-11-2014 12:15 AM

Southern USA- 'Tis the season: snakes
 
1 Attachment(s)
While salvaging some lumber and building materials, I found these two curled up in a rotted bowling ball bag. One died by repeated 2x4 blows and the other took a direct hit of CCI 9mm shot. Watch out because this pair makes three copperheads killed in the past week. FYI: I'm in Alabama.

Chrysalis 05-11-2014 05:33 AM

I was hunting morels last weekend and almost stepped on a nasty looking little devil, he reared up so I stepped back and took a couple pics. It was a hog-nosed snake. Turns out they aren't poisonous.

I was a little embarrassed because my niece was with me and had never heard me scream. She proceeded to tell the whole family when we got back. :rolleyes:

Guard68sman 05-11-2014 05:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by solinvictus (Post 6552721)
While salvaging some lumber and building materials, I found these two curled up in a rotted bowling ball bag. One died by repeated 2x4 blows and the other took a direct hit of CCI 9mm shot. Watch out because this pair makes three copperheads killed in the past week. FYI: I'm in Alabama.

Jesus!

Man I F'n hate snakes. I know many will disagree, but thank God you killed those little bastards.

Which one took the 9 mil?

I'm so glad I don't have to deal with those little bastards out here

barnetmill 05-11-2014 07:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by solinvictus (Post 6552721)
While salvaging some lumber and building materials, I found these two curled up in a rotted bowling ball bag. One died by repeated 2x4 blows and the other took a direct hit of CCI 9mm shot. Watch out because this pair makes three copperheads killed in the past week. FYI: I'm in Alabama.

A story: I worked with someone that when he was young in Pennsylvania his father killed all of the obvious large black snakes on the property. Soon there after copperheads started to appear. A neighboring farmer told them they should never kill the black snakes and went and caught some and released them on their property. There were no new copperheads seen thereafter. Anyway I normally leave the beneficial snakes alone. I am not completely convinced that they will always prevent dangerous snakes from taking up residence. Their absence certainly does leave a niche for them to live in. A large water moccasin is said to eat anything from carrion, turtles, birds, fish, other snakes, and mammals and might just regard the beneficial snakes as food. Still there is little good reason to kill all snakes on sight.

solinvictus 05-11-2014 07:37 AM

The one on the left took the CCI 9mm shot. The snake was curled, so it hit around 1/4 of the way down, dang near severed the body, then impacted the lower part of its body curled below. I have to say that the CCI impressed me because it nearly blew the snake in half.

trump3006 05-11-2014 07:48 AM

Oh I was thinking that one was result of "repeated 2x4 blows" and the other a slightly off 9mm head shot. Good job either way. I gotta contend the rattlers at the cabin. I was thinking of getting that 9mm or .40 cal CCI shot but I'm sold on it now.

Took a second look and wow yea that really did some damage.

Cool Hand 05-11-2014 07:55 AM

Mmmm mmmm ......lunch

Dragunov 05-11-2014 07:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gypsymoonfarm (Post 6552945)
I was hunting morels last weekend and almost stepped on a nasty looking little devil, he reared up so I stepped back and took a couple pics. It was a hog-nosed snake. Turns out they aren't poisonous.

I was a little embarrassed because my niece was with me and had never heard me scream. She proceeded to tell the whole family when we got back. :rolleyes:

Yes they are, I have the hospital bill, and scar to prove it. They don't bite under most circumstances, however, if you've been handling amphibians, particularly toads, they will bite as a feeding response. If you step on them, they will bite. And just in case you think I mis-identified the snake, I'm a Herpetologist. I was bitten by Heterodon platyrhinos (Eastern hognose snake).

Chrysalis 05-11-2014 08:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dragunov (Post 6553080)
Yes they are, I have the hospital bill, and scar to prove it. They don't bite under most circumstances, however, if you've been handling amphibians, particularly toads, they will bite as a feeding response. If you step on them, they will bite. And just in case you think I mis-identified the snake, I'm a Herpetologist. I was bitten by Heterodon platyrhinos (Eastern hognose snake).

My instant, gut reaction was fear. He looked poisonous. I've kept snakes as pets and have been bitten by young pythons when I worked in a pet shop. I actually love reptiles, but when this one flattened his head and rose up I backed away.

Thanks for sharing your experience, I had planned on a closer investigation because several sources said they aren't toxic to humans.

Dragunov 05-11-2014 08:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gypsymoonfarm (Post 6553098)
My instant, gut reaction was fear. He looked poisonous. I've kept snakes as pets and have been bitten by young pythons when I worked in a pet shop. I actually love reptiles, but when this one flattened his head and rose up I backed away.

Thanks for sharing your experience, I had planned on a closer investigation because several sources said they aren't toxic to humans.

Give me a minute, and I'll direct you to a couple posts of my full experience.

You don't need fear them, the ONLY way I've EVER seen them actually bite, are the two, above circumstances. Next time you run into one, tease him with a stick (don't hurt him though!) long enough, and he'll roll over and play dead.:)
They ARE actually gentle enough that children (under supervision) can handle them quite safely.

My account of the two Hoggie bites I've been involved with:

(Posts 29, and 30 are mine).

https://www.survivalistboards.com/sho...57#post6488457

Slclarry 05-11-2014 09:02 AM

Oh yes. Killed one last week in a flower bed at my garage. Promptly cut his head off with a pickax. Didn't really think about most of my utilities entering the house near there.

Later that night we noticed our internet was down. Bellsouth came out and verified the line in was open. As he was hooking up the new line he said usually this happened when people were digging in the yard. That's about the time "Rocket Scientist" here figured out what he had done.

No. At that point I didn't admit it to the tech. That stinking snake had to curl up over that line on purpose.

barnetmill 05-11-2014 09:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dragunov (Post 6553146)
Give me a minute, and I'll direct you to a couple posts of my full experience.

You don't need fear them, the ONLY way I've EVER seen them actually bite, are the two, above circumstances. Next time you run into one, tease him with a stick (don't hurt him though!) long enough, and he'll roll over and play dead.:)
They ARE actually gentle enough that children (under supervision) can handle them quite safely.

My account of the two Hoggie bites I've been involved with:

(Posts 29, and 30 are mine).

https://www.survivalistboards.com/sho...57#post6488457

I have just read your other posts on the link. I have read claims of people having reactions to other types of snake bite from what are considered non-venomous snakes. Venom is stated to come from modified salivary glands. Salivary glands are present in most snakes. If a snake can manage to lock its jaws on a part of your body those secretions can get into you system and may not be benign. Basically I do not handle snakes and l let them except for the vipers go on their way. Last time I dealt with a hognose snake I took a shovel and tossed it off my driveway into the woods. it would show there every fall. One year it apparently ended up at my neighbor's yard and she called another neighbor that came by and "bravely" kill it.

REM 05-11-2014 09:41 AM

This is the time of year here at least when they are in pairs, so if you see one look before you step. :)

barnetmill 05-11-2014 09:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by REM (Post 6553242)
This is the time of year here at least when they are in pairs, so if you see one look before you step. :)


My first snake sighting of the season was two snakes. It was one of our black pine racer snakes eating another snake. I think the other snake which was brown was a corn snake, but I am not sure. A week later I and my dogs saw 3ft corn snake crawling about. Dogs became agitated and barked a lot. One of them did hold her distance. and continued to make quite a racket. Good behavior for not getting bit. She has the build of the more ancient Alaunt type dogs and she is full of useful instincts. I am more fearful of my dogs getting bitten than I am for myself. A friend's dog got bitten by a pigmy rattler and it cost him almost $2,000 to treat it over night in doggie ICU. Neighbor's rottie/GSD mix of 120 lbs. was bitten by a small moccasin and was sick for about 2 weeks.

TxHannah 05-11-2014 11:06 AM

So far I've only seen baby copperheads. Hate to dispatch anything, but can't run the physical and financial risk of being bitten. With the drought the past few years I haven't even seen any cotton mouths. Non venomous snakes I leave alone.

Dragunov 05-11-2014 11:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by barnetmill (Post 6553208)
I have just read your other posts on the link. I have read claims of people having reactions to other types of snake bite from what are considered non-venomous snakes. Venom is stated to come from modified salivary glands. Salivary glands are present in most snakes. If a snake can manage to lock its jaws on a part of your body those secretions can get into you system and may not be benign. Basically I do not handle snakes and l let them except for the vipers go on their way. Last time I dealt with a hognose snake I took a shovel and tossed it off my driveway into the woods. it would show there every fall. One year it apparently ended up at my neighbor's yard and she called another neighbor that came by and "bravely" kill it.

I'm of a mind that ALL snakes have a mildly toxic saliva. However, the ones with "modified" glands, come in three varieties:

Vipers, and Pit vipers:
Gaboon vipers, Puff adders, European adders are true vipers, Cottonmouths, Rattlesnakes, Bushmasters, Waglers pit vipers, are all pit vipers.

Elapids:
Coral snakes, Mambas, cobras, Kraits, and sea snakes, are examples of Elapids.

Colubrids:
Boomslangs, Twig snakes, Mussuranas, Hognose snakes, Lyre snakes, Night snakes, and Mangrove snakes, are all examples of Rear-fanged Colubrids.

Any of the above, can/will cause systemic envenomation, so be careful around them.

Macdaddy 05-11-2014 11:18 AM

I never killed a snake on purpose. I figure they are benificial even the poisionus ones. I use to catch snakes of all types when I was young even copperheads. I am aware of their habitats and avoid them during the warm seasons.

barnetmill 05-11-2014 11:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dragunov (Post 6553429)
I'm of a mind that ALL snakes have a mildly toxic saliva. However, the ones with "modified" glands, come in three varieties:

Vipers, and Pit vipers:
Gaboon vipers, Puff adders, European adders are true vipers, Cottonmouths, Rattlesnakes, Bushmasters, Waglers pit vipers, are all pit vipers.

Elapids:
Coral snakes, Mambas, cobras, Kraits, and sea snakes, are examples of Elapids.

Colubrids:
Boomslangs, Twig snakes, Mussuranas, Hognose snakes, Lyre snakes, Night snakes, and Mangrove snakes, are all examples of Rear-fanged Colubrids.

Any of the above, can/will cause systemic envenomation, so be careful around them.

I did not realize that Hognose snakes were in there with the Boomslang. Are there any other rear-fang Colubrid snakes in the united states?

I looked it up: and there is an article: Evidence of toxic saliva in some colubrid snakes of the United States

Donald M. McKinstry Toxicon Volume 16, Issue 6, 1978, Pages 523–534
I could get the abstract, but not the article. Yes there is quite a bit of potential toxicity in quite few snakes since this is a very large serpent family.

Dragunov 05-11-2014 03:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by barnetmill (Post 6553473)
I did not realize that Hognose snakes were in there with the Boomslang. Are there any other rear-fang Colubrid snakes in the united states?

I looked it up: and there is an article: Evidence of toxic saliva in some colubrid snakes of the United States

Donald M. McKinstry Toxicon Volume 16, Issue 6, 1978, Pages 523–534
I could get the abstract, but not the article. Yes there is quite a bit of potential toxicity in quite few snakes since this is a very large serpent family.

I'll just give common names:

Hognose snakes.
Night snakes.
Lyre snakes.
Ring neck snakes.
Crowned snake (Mostly in Mexico).

Hognose, and Lyre snakes (cat eyed) are the only ones with enough venom to make you take notice.

barnetmill 05-11-2014 03:46 PM

I am taking a break from brush clearing. I ran out to empty two tank fulls on my husky weed whacker that has a 10' studded tungsten carbide blade on it. I saw the biggest black snake I have ever seen. This snake was easily 4 ft and could have been also an indigo snake. Moving fast like they usually do on a mission to find food which is great with me.


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