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should i make this trade for an ar

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iwillsurvive5

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Discussion starter · #1 ·
http://www.armslist.com/posts/4788337

I offered an aimpoint comp m4 (paid $500)
4x Ak74 mags, two Russian, two Bulgarian, mag pouch (cost about $25 ea)
4x Ak47 magd one Russian Bakelite 40 round, one Russian steel, 40 round Chinese smooth spine, and an eastern European (cost about 25 ea)
Nagant Chinese carbine (traded 4 fal mags cost me $20 plus $15 ffl)
 
#5 ·
iwillsurvive5 said:
He said he was interested in my tentative offer and to send pic. If he writes again i'll ask further on the details of his gun. I wouldn't think it's super high end as his dollar asking price is $1100
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Don't ascribed value to the rifle just because of his asking price..if its a home built rifle it didn't cost that much.. so press him on who put it togeather..where did the parts come from..if he's comfortable with the quality he will be comfortable with the questions..
 
#6 ·
The Old Coach said:
People selling on Armslist (or Gunbroker for that matter) are unloading their problem children on other people, hopefully far enough away that they can't return the gun when they find out that they bought a lemon.
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Yep, unloaded my Sig 556 there (tho in all fairness, it fired EVER EE THING!!!) Just couldn't make the ergonomics work for me
 
#7 ·
If you look at his rifle, there are a few BIG warning signs.

First and foremost is the use of a Stark pistol grip+trigger guard one piece unit. This is a sign of someone possibly having damaged their lower installing the trigger guard pin (most common LPK install tardmark, if you don't know the safe way of hammering in this pin, you can bend or more often, break off the trigger guard ear in the process). Maybe, but probably not, he just likes the idea of this particular pistol grip, but it's a minority consideration if you think about it. The primary reason for that pistol grip is if you shouldn't have or fear installing that pin. I would ask him about it.

Second, that optic looks like a cheap Chinese model (look it up, you'll find at least a few like this one based on the profile).

Otherwise that does look like a Troy Alpha rail, Troy sights and that is either a Troy Medieval FH or brake along with the Troy vert. grip. Along with the Troy mags, that upper might actually be a Troy build.

The (hopefully) actual Magpul ACS says something, but, if the guy spent the money on a good Troy comp. upper and a Spikes lower, why did he half-ass it with the Chin. optic and low end grip? And since I don't see a build on Spike's sight with the ACS as part of a standard package, it probably isn't a complete Spikes build meaning he probably installed the LPK and who knows who's LPK it is (there are bad ones).

Maybe despite all of these issues, your trade, if he'll agree to it, is still worth it. Worst part is once you get the rifle you may want to replace some parts just to be sure (and of course get its head space confirmed, people buy the parts, throw them together and don't know to even consider getting this checked/proven). I would consider the optic a throwaway and you may be risking it with the grip covering a broken ear on the receiver, not that even that is the end of the world. If you can get into this AR for super cheap then a few bucks to bring it up to minimal spec. might still be worth it. Also, if you're looking to rid yourself of some no-longer-useful/needed parts like your list, then getting project rifle would be worth it either way.
 
#9 ·
I would be hesitant, Parker made a great observation on the grip and the possibility of the broken trigger guard ears.

He says its a Spikes Tactical, but as of right now Spikes Doesnt offer any barrels longer than 16" other than the Lothar Walther 18" Fluted 'SPR" barrel, That gun has a 15" Alpha rail on it, so the Barrel is 18" but not fluted so I cant say if its a Spikes Barrel or not, it could be a discontinued model factory built from Spikes, or it could just be a striped upper receiver he bought from the spikes website I dont know.
If its a Factory produced gun, or something he bought new at a gun shop he should have the receipt and build sheet telling you how much it cost and what it actually is.

The scope is crap, I think its an Older Barska "sniper/tactical" POS, Im not sure, I am sure that its not anything good or worth keeping on the gun.

There are a million Fake Troy BUIS on Ebay, so I would want really good pics and a receipt for those as well.

The stock is Magpul with the enhanced buttpad, But again could be a PRS product (the airsoft version) ask for good pics, they are stamped PRS so there is no confusion, they look identical but are made with an inferior plastic, not the great Dupont FRN.

The Troy Mags are decent, I dont like them because I broke one dropping it onto pavement while loaded from about waist height, But should be fine for flat range practice or target shooting. But they are like $10 a piece so shouldnt be added into the value of the package.


Best Case Scenario you are still looking at a Used AR with a crap scope, and I certainly dont think its worth $1100

Breaking it down into parts
15" Alpha Rail $220
Troy BUIS $180-220 (if they are real)
Magpul ACS $90 enhanced buttpad $20 (again if its not PRS airsoft stuff)

here is where it gets tricky
Lower $150
Lower parts $100-400 depending on trigger

Upper $100
Barrel $150-600 depending on what it actually is. Its at least 18" and it looks pretty thin profile, so I am going to assume the barrel is fine but on the lower end of the price spectrum.
Bolt/Carrier $100-220 depending on who made it and if its an AR-15 carrier or an M16 carrier.

So I would get some straight answers before you make any trade, that is a terrible ad with absolutely no information on the gun other than its an AR-15.

But making a gut call on It I would say dont make the trade for what you offered.

The Aimpoint Comp m4 you have is certainly worth the $500 depending on its condition maybe more (since you got it for $500, im assuming its not mint so $500 is fair)
Your Chinese Mosin Carbine, again depending on the condition is a what $100-120 rifle?
So right there without the AK mags or pouches you are at entry level AR prices.

Honestly I would try to keep that Aimpoint for the AR once you get it. I have made the mistake of selling/trading good optics before and really regretted it later when I went back to buy a cheaper version of the same damn thing I already had.

Even if that Comp m4 is beat to hell and works its honestly worth hanging on to, because it will keep on working.


If you keep your eyes open for sales and are patient (plus are reasonably skilled with your hands and have the tools) you can build yourself a very nice AR for about $550-600, I built a lightweight AR with a spikes 14.5" barrel for about that

I got all my stuff on sale over a period of a few months, and built a mean little rifle that I would stack against any factory gun.

I hope this helps
 
#10 ·
The Old Coach said:
People selling on Armslist (or Gunbroker for that matter) are unloading their problem children on other people, hopefully far enough away that they can't return the gun when they find out that they bought a lemon.
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That is a ridiculous generalization. I've bought and sold multiple firearms on Armslist, none of which were "problem children". The ones I sold were just because I wanted something else and the ones I bought were cause they were a decent deal for something I wanted. Haven't had a problem with any of them.
 
#11 ·
Mr Parker said:
If you look at his rifle, there are a few BIG warning signs.

First and foremost is the use of a Stark pistol grip+trigger guard one piece unit. This is a sign of someone possibly having damaged their lower installing the trigger guard pin (most common LPK install tardmark, if you don't know the safe way of hammering in this pin, you can bend or more often, break off the trigger guard ear in the process). Maybe, but probably not, he just likes the idea of this particular pistol grip, but it's a minority consideration if you think about it. The primary reason for that pistol grip is if you shouldn't have or fear installing that pin. I would ask him about it.
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:xeye: What?

I chose that grip because I like the ergo's and the fact it lowers your hand so your trigger finger lines up more like a handgun. The fact that it integrates the trigger guard is nice. Slick and simple. I tried different grips before and after the Stark, but kept coming back to the Stark, and settled with it.

Being afraid of some little pin was in no way a factor for me.


OP:

What I see in that pic, is a rifle that appears to have carefully selected accessories. It looks well put together which implies care and attention to detail.

Besides the scope - looks like crap, but he probably ran out of money.


Looking at what you are offering, I'd say go for it, if you really want the AR.
 
#12 ·
The Old Coach said:
People selling on Armslist (or Gunbroker for that matter) are unloading their problem children on other people, hopefully far enough away that they can't return the gun when they find out that they bought a lemon.
Click to expand...
This is not at all true. I've purchased dozens of firearms through gunbroker and never had a lemon. The worst I've gotten is one that had scratches in the finish or blue that weren't disclosed but on used guns that's to be expected
 
#13 ·
Receipts for his build or I say no go. A lot of the guys building franken guns put them together with stripped name brand receivers/rail/furniture and then skimp on the stuff that matters (BCG, barrel, LPK, etc).

The only way I would even think about an $1100 trade value on the gun he has listed is if the entire upper is Troy built. You can get an entire BCM gun for what he is asking for. If the whole build isn't that level of quality, pass.
 
#14 ·
Surviving208 said:
This is not at all true. I've purchased dozens of firearms through gunbroker and never had a lemon. The worst I've gotten is one that had scratches in the finish or blue that weren't disclosed but on used guns that's to be expected
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Yeah, same here. I've been a regular buyer/seller/trader on my local Armslist for several years, and for the past year, on TheOutDoorsTrader as well, and I've been nearly 100% happy with every deal I've done, and I surely haven't been stuck with anyone's lemon. I haven't even met any sketchy individuals, they've almost all been great folks, often we have mutual freinds, and I've run into guys I knew from previous deals, several times. More often than not, after doing the deal, we're still standing in the parking lot for another 20 minutes yacking about guns,politics,football,etc.
I'm gonna miss Armslist terribly when it's gone. :(
 
#15 ·
Seriously..... New In Box with a Warranty Guns are so cheap now, why even bother to take a chance. Or build your own. PSA has sales daily and with the Holiday just around the corner, you know there will be sales. Just my .02.
 
#17 ·
SBK said:
That is a ridiculous generalization. I've bought and sold multiple firearms on Armslist, none of which were "problem children". The ones I sold were just because I wanted something else and the ones I bought were cause they were a decent deal for something I wanted. Haven't had a problem with any of them.
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I wanted a Kimber 1911 and the stores around here all said 12 to 14 months wait time at full list price, take it or leave it or get a used one. I checked with Kimber and the long wait was verified. I looked on GUNBROKER a found the EXACT model I wanted at 29% off list price from a store in another state. With shipping and FFL it was still about 10% off list and delivered in 35 days versus 30 days if the store had one in stock or 12 to 14 months of real wait time.

Just like anything online - Caveat Emptor - Buyer Beware!
 
#18 ·
Last month I bought a complete PSA rifle kit with a 16" S/S 1 in 8 bbl and a milspec bcg for $396 shipped. One of there weekend only sales ( normally $420 ). Added to that a new Bushmaster stripped lower from Bangit Ammo for $50 shipped and $15 xfer (bought 6 months ago) and I built a good quality rifle for $461. It has a $50 Sightmark Optic on it and now it lives in my truck. The prices are low and the deals are out there for now.
 
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