Survivalist Forum banner
21 - 40 of 40 Posts
Discussion starter · #22 ·
I think I cannot avoid them but I can minimize their impact. Trade as much as possible in the parallel economy but pay for gasoline and parking tickets with digital bank tokens, identified by my smartphone. Seems like it’s just the way it’s going to be, no way around it.
 
How will you be paying your property taxes and any insurance premiums?
It's been virtually impossible to live a 100% cash-only life for a long time.
You can pay your property taxes in cash. Our local State Farm takes cash as well. You could do health insurance via a money order. Lots of Mexicans, Strippers, bar/restaurant owners/staff drug dealers and other assorted criminals live primarily on cash.
 
Discussion starter · #24 ·
You can pay your property taxes in cash. Our local State Farm takes cash as well. You could do health insurance via a money order. Lots of Mexicans, Strippers, bar/restaurant owners/staff drug dealers and other assorted criminals live primarily on cash.
That’s today, and not in a world where cash is useless.
 
There is already a way around it. Its the development of our own currency. Check out the Goldbacks currently in use out west. That is just one example of what we the people are doing to counter this threat. The other forms out there now are not gonna be made public for obvious opsec purposes. If you got property tax to pay in the future, and they no longer accept regular cash like they do now, you simply find a trusted associate who deals with cbdc currency, trade them out the value in something else, and they pay it for you in your name. There is always a way around. They cant stop us.
 
Discussion starter · #26 ·
There is already a way around it. Its the development of our own currency. Check out the Goldbacks currently in use out west. That is just one example of what we the people are doing to counter this threat. The other forms out there now are not gonna be made public for obvious opsec purposes. If you got property tax to pay in the future, and they no longer accept regular cash like they do now, you simply find a trusted associate who deals with cbdc currency, trade them out the value in something else, and they pay it for you in your name. There is always a way around. They cant stop us.
Funny you should mention Goldbacks. My wife just opened her Christmas present of a fiver Goldback. Not much money but still made her smile.

The digital ID would probably prevent you from asking an associate to pay your bills.
 
Funny you should mention Goldbacks. My wife just opened her Christmas present of a fiver Goldback. Not much money but still made her smile.

The digital ID would probably prevent you from asking an associate to pay your bills.
There are already alot of stores out west that will only accept Goldbacks, and not any form of government money. Just a sign of whats coming for all those who dont accept tyranny.

You will be able to pay brokers who deal with cbdc to pay your bills for you. We already have hackers just waiting for the digital id system to be developed, so they can find a way around it. Its not gonna be anywhere near as hard to get around as people are suspecting.
 
There are already alot of stores out west that will only accept Goldbacks, and not any form of government money. Just a sign of whats coming for all those who dont accept tyranny.

You will be able to pay brokers who deal with cbdc to pay your bills for you. We already have hackers just waiting for the digital id system to be developed, so they can find a way around it. Its not gonna be anywhere near as hard to get around as people are suspecting.
What stores accept only gold backs and how does one make money buying $10 of gold for $20, that has a denomination of 5?
 
Discussion starter · #32 · (Edited)
Well one way to use Goldbacks is to sell them to buy CBDC credits, then use that to pay the bills that can only be paid by CBDCs.

That's assuming they don't confiscate them; Last time gold was confiscated, if you tried to sell any you risked arrest, something that would be even more likely in today's surveillance culture. Couldn't transport gold, couldn't safely buy with it; Or if you could find someone who'd take it, they'd have to take a risk to obtain it and buy it--all of which reduces the value. I wouldn't say it'd be worthless, but it'd be worth less.
 
How will you be paying your property taxes and any insurance premiums?
Cash. Check. "Legal tender for all debts pubic and private" doesn't mean a business has to accept cash. It means the government has to take it. NY, NJ, OR, and some places in CA have local laws requiring businesses to take cash.

In a hypothetical where there are now laws, what does it matter what legal or not? Do whatever you want. The thing about bad laws is they don't work long term without a large amount (like 99%) public support. Even a small amount of people who go against something cause major problems. Are you going to jail 5% of the US population for not paying taxes under a law that didn't exist 6 months ago? I don't see it ever happening.

I do think CBDC is coming but I don't see it ever being forced, even if it happens tomorrow it'd be stuck in court for 50 years. Just like you can own PMs of crypto today and do what you want with them. If you want to use it, go for it. If you don't want a CBDC put in the effort to use cash today. That's really all an individual can do.
 
Maybe a clearer way to say that is contract law matters. If you're in the US your job has a contract that pays in dollars. In the EU it's euros. Your mortgage has a contract that owe debt to them in dollars. Income taxes you owe is in dollars, based on your mortgage. Neither party can decide to change the currency on a whim.

If contract law stops mattering to the government and courts you've got a lot bigger problems than how you're going to pay your property taxes. If either party violates the contract it's broken and you sign a new contract.
 
Discussion starter · #37 ·
Cash. Check. "Legal tender for all debts pubic and private" doesn't mean a business has to accept cash. It means the government has to take it. NY, NJ, OR, and some places in CA have local laws requiring businesses to take cash.

In a hypothetical where there are now laws, what does it matter what legal or not? Do whatever you want. The thing about bad laws is they don't work long term without a large amount (like 99%) public support. Even a small amount of people who go against something cause major problems. Are you going to jail 5% of the US population for not paying taxes under a law that didn't exist 6 months ago? I don't see it ever happening.

I do think CBDC is coming but I don't see it ever being forced, even if it happens tomorrow it'd be stuck in court for 50 years. Just like you can own PMs of crypto today and do what you want with them. If you want to use it, go for it. If you don't want a CBDC put in the effort to use cash today. That's really all an individual can do.
I should have clarified: My question is in a world where CBDCs are the only means allowed for the paying for public and private debts. And it might be "digital dollars," which feel like old cash. Few people are aware for example that the US govt defaulted in 1971 with the closing of the gold window (and the gold-backed dollar), effectively converting the US dollar into a different kind of currency than was used in 1970.
 
Discussion starter · #38 ·
Maybe a clearer way to say that is contract law matters. If you're in the US your job has a contract that pays in dollars. In the EU it's euros. Your mortgage has a contract that owe debt to them in dollars. Income taxes you owe is in dollars, based on your mortgage. Neither party can decide to change the currency on a whim.

If contract law stops mattering to the government and courts you've got a lot bigger problems than how you're going to pay your property taxes. If either party violates the contract it's broken and you sign a new contract.
In 1971, people still paid back their debts with 1971 no-gold dollars, even though they were fundamentally different than 1970 gold-backed dollars. To the eyes of the average Joe, a dollar is a dollar is a dollar--even when it's not.

In the same way, 2024's "digital dollars" could be fundamentally different than 2023 dollars in the underlying way they work, but legally, superficially, identical to the old, and the only currency acceptable to pay back debts, public and private. 2023 and prior notes would need to be converted or destroyed to be legally used.

One precedent for this was in 1933 with gold.
 
Well one way to use Goldbacks is to sell them to buy CBDC credits, then use that to pay the bills that can only be paid by CBDCs.

That's assuming they don't confiscate them; Last time gold was confiscated, if you tried to sell any you risked arrest, something that would be even more likely in today's surveillance culture. Couldn't transport gold, couldn't safely buy with it; Or if you could find someone who'd take it, they'd have to take a risk to obtain it and buy it--all of which reduces the value. I wouldn't say it'd be worthless, but it'd be worth less.
So in the US, you could still own up to 5 oz of gold. So most of us could use that to pay our property tax. Thatts 20 oz/$40k for a family of 4.
 
Discussion starter · #40 · (Edited)
Remember that property tax is not the only expense. Buying gasoline or diesel could prove problematic. People on the street don't value precious metals like they should (watch the video below), so don't expect to walk into your corner Shell station and fill up with some pre-1964 coins, unless you have a pre-existing agreement with the guy behind the counter. Forget long road trips, that's almost certainly out of the question unless you haul a bunch of gas cans with you.

Maybe you've got an EV and off-grid power, so you don't need to worry about the gas station. Or you make your own alcohol or you have a wood fueled-car.

Electricity, water, and sewer bills currently demand US dollars and would likely demand payment a new US digital dollar; If you're not on off-grid now, get there ASAP.

No home internet without using new digital dollars and a digital ID; That's okay, you tell yourself that internet is a tool of the devil and brings more harm than good. You still have rabbit ears and DVDs for entertainment.

If you're self-employed, expect to pay license fees and annual taxes with new US digital dollars. Maybe switch careers now while it's easy.

Never going to fly or ride a train with gold; Maybe you've decided you're staying on the farm now for life.

As mentioned before, insurance. You can be sure that all insurance companies will only take the new US digital dollar. Some people go their entire lives without insurance, though I don't recommend it.

Auto repairs could be dicey. If you have a great relationship with your mechanic, or if you turn your own wrench, that's wonderful! Just hope you're not broken down away from home, as we were on a 2015 road trip. Had to not only pay the mechanic but also the tow truck, the motel, and the grocery store.

Buying a new car? Hope it's from a relative or someone you know well; Since most people don't value precious metals, they're probably not going to value--or perhaps even trust--someone showing up with gold in hand. Maybe they think to themselves your gold is counterfeit and no talking will convince them otherwise.

Got into a car accident, went unconscious, was immediately taken to the hospital without being able to talk first to family members? You will probably have to default on the hospital bill. That's okay, you tell yourself; You don't care about a credit rating anymore.

Can't find a cell phone company that will let me pay in Bitcoin. That's okay, we have ham radios and CB. I didn't need the distractions of a cell phone anyway.

Time to renew your driver's license; The bribe cost you a 1/4 ounce golden eagle coin (currently worth $660) but it was worth it. Start saving now; Your license renews again in eight years.

No one at Walmart will accept either silver or Bitcoin, so you've taken up sewing to tailor clothes from the thrift store whose owner you know personally.

House not paid off? Is your mortgage with a large bank? Good luck finding someone who will take platinum rounds, or crypto.

Renting from a large corporation? Maybe it's time to downgrade to an RV on some land you paid cash for. Hope you can find someone who will take coins for the title search and court document stamps.


I'm not saying to accept a new US digital dollar. I am saying, weigh the costs. Life as you know it might be very different in just a few short years. This move feels like a checkmate to me. It's either game on with the full prepper plan, or take some digital dollars but don't depend on them over-much. How you proceed is up to you.

"For which of you, desiring to build a tower, does not first sit down and count the cost, whether he has enough to complete it?" (Luke 14:28)

 
21 - 40 of 40 Posts