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WilliamAshley

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Discussion starter · #1 ·
Ok,

So I know things like milk can be reprocessed into things like curds, sour cream etc..

However just some questions.


1. Is there a way you can tell if something like cookies have gone rancid?

No signs of mold but a few months past their best before date? Will they go rancid and if so how can you know?

I don't need a lecture on not eating food past its best before date or expiry date, thanks.

2. Mold, things like black mold on food (green mold) and white fuzz not likely to be dangerous in small amounts. The mold itself isn't dangerous when cooked, just the mycotoxins that the mold has produced and deposited in the food. I am curious if there are any methods to render moldy food safer to eat. Some foods can just have the mold removed, like blue mold on cheese, penicillium etc.. and eaten.

However I am wondering if there are methods to render the mold or mycotoxins less harmful.

Things like washing, cooking, salting using antibacterial products etc..

Anyone thought about rendering "spoiled food" usable.

Things that are naturally fermented are likely usable.

Yes I don't need a lecture on the dangers of botulism.

Just looking for suggestions on ways to improve it, not the dangers that exist in it.
 
#3 ·
I don't need a lecture on not eating food past its best before date or expiry date, thanks.
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Talk to the Aghori about this, and if you can understand, your questions will become moot.

Aghoris are devotees of Shiva manifested as Bhairava,[5] and monists who seek moksha from the cycle of reincarnation or saṃsāra. This freedom is a realization of the self's identity with the absolute. Because of this monistic doctrine, the Aghoris maintain that all opposites are ultimately illusory. The purpose of embracing pollution and degradation through various customs is the realization of non-duality (advaita) through transcending social taboos, attaining what is essentially an altered state of consciousness and perceiving the illusory nature of all conventional categories.
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aghori

You say this is not helpful, I disagree, sometimes it is better to approach these things from a much higher level of abstraction, then deal with the details from an illuminated perspective.
 
#6 ·
Don't ask others to assist you trying to be stupid. It's insulting.
 
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#8 ·
WilliamAshley,

So you will not engage on any level but the mundane, that informs as to your personality. How you react to people's responses to your rather odd questions reveals much.

I think I understand why you ask this question about spoiled food, two possibilities.

There may come a time in a given SHTF situation where this knowledge may be critical to survival, no matter how well one plans and prepares. But know this, you cannot know with the level of certitude necessary to avoid sickness or death, when attempting to detect whether or not food is spoiled, toxic, without a lab. Any attempt to do so, or mitigate the spoilage, is gambling with your life from a position of abiding ignorance. You will be attempting to ascertain with certitude utilizing relative magic, and this is exactly why man developed and cultivated science.

Yes, there is some validity to knowing methodologies to address your question of dealing with spoiled food, but the attempt will reflect a last ditch effort, the lower extreme of the attempt to survive, and the highest probability is that you will fail, become sick and die.

Because people realize this, they avoid addressing the question in favor of better planning, more preparation, to avoid exactly such a deadly scenario.

The second possible motivation for you asking this question is far more troubling, that is, you are making this dangerous attempt in the now, for whatever reason, and that infers what(?), that you are in a desperate position, either through unfortunate circumstance or through poor planning, an inability to meet your needs in a rational, logical fashion while living in the land of plenty.

If you are experimenting in this regard without absolute necessity, then you are insane, suicidal, and that is why people are responding to you in the manner that they are.

You also create a bad example for those who are not experienced enough to see the absolute idiocy of playing around with such dangerous things.
 
#9 ·
OK.

To start with. some molds will hurt you and some will not. If you do not know what has caused the spoilage I would not eat it unless desperate.

However, deliberately spoiling food has been a major method to preserve food since before recorded history. That cheese you mentioned has been made from deliberately spoiled milk. And, while ACCIDENTLY spoiled milk does taste bad the PROBABLE cause of the milk being spoiled is not dangerous: jst foul tasting. The micro organisms that consume milk TEND to not be dangerous

Wine is juice that has been spoiled because of the wild yeast that lives on the outside of each and every grape. Some tastes better than others but you can allow most fruits to ferment and eat them anyways.

Whole grain that has molded due to excess humidity: Don't eat it: there are too many possible dangerous organisms that will grow under these conditions. Look up aflatoxin and ergot. In places like Italy that is prone to mild and humid winters the grain is ground and turned into pasta because the pasta is far less likely to spoil. Pasta was a medieval method of preserving the grain harvest more safely. That bread might be spoiled because of penicillin which may not hurt you, but, do not mess around with moldy whole grain.

As for cookies, if in doubt taste a corner and see if the fat in the cookie has gone rancid. I do not know anything more to tell you about cookies.

Microorganisms tend to not play well together. That means that if you can deliberately spoil a food, such as bleu cheese or wine, it is far less likely to be colonized by a dangerous organism.

Remember that yeasts give food an alcoholic scent, and if you are eating spoiled food that alcohol scent is a good sign that the food might not be harmful. Fruit and grain can easily be preserved with yeast and fermentation, and it occurs in nature. And, many barbarian cultures preserved milk by putting it in a skin with a little yogurt inside of it. They would eat the yogurt, milk their animal, and put fresh milk into the skin that used to contain yogurt and, preferably still has a cup or two of yogurt still inside.
 
#15 ·
ajole said:
After you get your first case of food poisoning, this will all become moot.

Seriously....it's just not worth it.
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BINGO. Words of wisdom.

I've had disabling food poisoning 3 times. You do NOT want it and it theoretically can be life threatening without proper hydration, or even medicine and hospitalization. In SHTF you don't want to be eating questionable foods.

In my house, if it looks or smells bad, it gets thrown out. The minor calories and cost is not worth 1 - 5 days of disabling illness.

* Caveat. I have two hungry dogs and dogs have stronger digestive enzymes and constitutions. They can literally eat foul things and not get sick (not on purpose but my dogs have eaten animal feces, raw meats, etc.). I often give them cooked meats, cheese, or fruits that may be a slightly past my liking, that would otherwise go in the trash. DO NOT MISUNDERSTAND, I'm not feeding them dangerous spoiled foods; just foods that are on the edge and would be thrown out but could probably be safe for human consumption but just unpleasant to taste.

My dogs love brown bananas, soft apples, soft carrots, etc. I'll scrape the mold off the cheese and they get the treat. The other day, I had about 4 fully cooked chicken breasts that just started to go bad. I trimmed off the bad sections, washed off the meat, nuked it for a few minutes to kill any bacteria, and the dogs got several pounds of chopped chicken... But having said that I would never give my dogs anything I thought might harm them.

If there is ANY doubt, throw it out.
 
#18 ·
I've gone without food... Without water for a few days sounds dangerous.

Re spoilEd cookies?
When crunchy cookies go soft... I ain't eatin them.

When milk curdles, I have made cottage cheese, and even real cheese, homogenized or not.
I've also had that science project not work out on occasion. It's ok, the cats like sour milk.

I'm surprised to read all the stories on food poisoning... I've lived on dumpster food for months at a time with no problems...
But... The news remains constant about recalls of contaminated food, people getting sick from restaurant food, ending up in the hospital from fresh cooked chicken...

Probably safest to avoid eating anything.
 
#19 ·
Several areas of study might answer your questions.

First expiration dates: Are usually generous because no company wants to deal with selling bad food! They try to account for poor storage and transport in their dates! Proper storage after you get it helps, but most things even though they are loosing nutrients/quality are edible past the generous expiration date!

Eating bad food: Much can be learned from history! Much bd food eaten during wars, famines ect! Learn from them!

SD
 
#20 ·
Kansas Terri said:
If by processed you mean homogenized, I have done it often.
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I have used homogenized/pasteurized before spoiling by adding culture to it. However since it has no active culture in it I would be interested in how you were able to use it after spoiling. When mine spoils it first sours but smells rotten by the time it starts to clabber and I pour it out for the possums.
 
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