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Old 02-07-2010, 06:16 PM
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Default Accuracy difference between the Springfield M1A Standard vs Loaded?



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I am going to be buying a Springfield M1a as my first true battle rifle, but I wanted to know the accuracy difference (in moa) between the M1a Standard versus the M1a Loaded? I am trying to see if the higher end Loaded version is worth the extra cost...

For some reason, I cannot find any information on this important question online.....
Old 02-07-2010, 07:41 PM
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I have the standard version, it works well and there are no issues.

The only things that I did to it was, tighten the rear sight, added a bit of purple loctite to the front sight screw and added a G.I. synthetic stock.

The rear sight was tightened by expanding the sides of the sight to give it a snug fit, I don't remember at the moment what gunsmiths call this technique.

From what I have seen on the different gun websites, it seems that people with the loaded versions have more problems. It could be that they have a tighter chamber or maybe the owner has to be smarter than the rifle.
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Old 02-07-2010, 08:15 PM
funfaler funfaler is offline
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With LITTLE DOUBT, get the Standard over the Loaded.

The differences are:
Loaded has...
-Match trigger
-Match rear sight
-Match chambered barrel.

Here is the real story.

The match trigger is a Springfield trigger, nice, but any USGI trigger group will give you as good or better trigger pull AND will be a more durable group.

Take the money you save from purchasing the Standard and seek out and purchase an USGI trigger group. Use it, keep your Standard trigger group as a spare.

The Match Rear sight is the Un-hooded sight. This means that ONLY the windage is different than the standard. So, you have 1/2 MOA per click on the match, 1 MOA for the Standard. You will never know the difference. Even the hooded sight is not worth it for the 1/2 moa adjustment, only for the glare reduction.

The matched chambered barrel is not needed. The Standard will give you plenty of accuracy, to allow you (if you can) to hit targets out to 500 yards with iron sights, with surplus ammo. The match chamber has been cause of failure to feed/eject for surplus ammo, in both the Loaded and Match versions.

If you plan on shooting competition, then you will want to build your rifle, get the Standard today, shoot it until you learn to out shoot it, then use the receiver (if still in spec) to build a Match rifle.

Since you are on survivalist board, I would assume you are not looking for a competition rifle. I can tell you this, the difference in "accuracy" between the Loaded and Standard is not something that you will ever notice or miss. In fact, using surplus ammo, I would doubt there is any difference, with the better reliability going to the Standard.

If you were to run Match commercial ammo in both, you might see a 1/4 moa accuracy difference (that is about 1 1/4 inch at 500 yards).....maybe, but it is difficult to qualify this.

Again, the $$ you save with the Standard, put toward the USGI trigger, which is the only positive the Loaded has over the Standard.

BTW, Springfield says they are only installing match front sights on ALL of their M1As, so both the Standard/Loaded have the match front sight, which is good.
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Old 02-07-2010, 08:34 PM
magfed556 magfed556 is offline
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I have the Loaded version, have shot all variants of the M1A. The Loaded will if you do your part and use quality ammo shoot as well as the NM. I have also out shot a couple of Super Match's but I think it might have been the shooters.
I think the Loaded is well worth the extra doe.
Old 02-07-2010, 09:46 PM
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Well put Funfaler. (Saved me a bunch of typing).

I would rather have a std than a loaded for the purpose of a go to/SHTF rifle.
Out of the rifles I have fired, the difference in accuracy was so minute, that it didnt justify the additional cost..for me at least. (My go to rifles are sporting 18.5inbbls, but thats a whole other topic
This gives me the best accuracy/reliability/long term durability/OAL/balance vs the other models.


I would recomend that you get the std for the same reasons as Funfaler mentioned. Shoot it as is, and only add accuracy mods if you need it as you go along, and without sacrificing reliability. ( Note: A NM M1A is designed for competion use in mind, and not for use as a combat rifle IMO. The added potential accuracy is diminished by the additional weight, close tolerances which ammount to close fitting parts, and tight chambers that are best suited for match loadings.)

Are you planning to use optics with this rifle after you become proficient with the iron sights?

One little thing that might be worth mentioning is to use rifle grease with any M1A/M14 if you want it to run at it's optimum level.

11B
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Old 02-08-2010, 12:17 AM
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Ok, I think I'm leaning towards the Standard now...... All I care about is if this gun is "battle accurate".....I'm not a competition shooter.

Also, I have another question: What are the average prices of the Standard and Loaded M1a's?

I checked on Gunbroker and elsewhere, but I cannot find enough of a sample size to accurately determine the average price of these guns. I feel that Gunbroker prices are inflated, anyway.
Old 02-08-2010, 05:36 AM
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A good price on a used sythentic stock Springfield M1A is $1200 bare bones with a single mag. I have not seen them below that for a long time and they are not frequently sold used anyway. Almost better off buying new sometimes.

SOCOM's, with their ferocious muzzle blast, sometimes sell for pretty good prices used; I have seen two in the last few weeks around here go for $1200 w/ 7 mags and another like new for $1400.
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Old 02-08-2010, 09:17 AM
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I've never had any problem with any of my loaded M1A's,(have two, had four) they consistantly shoot about an inch less than STD/ scout models(with store bought ammo) without a single failure. My loaded models cost $200 more than an STD model, for $200, you get a medium weight match air gauged barrel(price a medium weight match barrel + installation cost), half MOA sights, match tirgger group, that is just as good, if not better than "GI" and NM flash suppressor. That's ALOT of upgrades for $200. Mine do 1.5" @ 100 yards with iron sights, .75" with telescope(handloads). If you bought a STD and later decided to do the upgrades it would cost well over $1000. The STD is a damn fine rifle, but for a couple hundred bucks more, the loaded is well worth it, whether you care about accuracy or not, it's better to have it and not need it than need it and not have it.
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Old 02-08-2010, 01:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SHTF-Alerts.com View Post
Ok, I think I'm leaning towards the
Also, I have another question: What are the average prices of the Standard and Loaded M1a's?

I checked on Gunbroker and elsewhere, but I cannot find enough of a sample size to accurately determine the average price of these guns. I feel that Gunbroker prices are inflated, anyway.
I always go to Bud's Gun shop: http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/index.php

My experience has been that they have the lowest prices, consistently. So, I look at their prices, for the new firearms, then adjust my expectation accordingly.

Add to their price: Shipping, $25 for dealer transfer, then sales tax. This will give you a price to use in negotiations. If your dealer is not close to their price, plus the additions mentioned above, then simply order it from Buds.

Also, I would not have any issues purchasing a used Standard M1A. If the shooter is a competitive shooter, they would have traded up long before they "shoot out" their Standard. If they are not a competitive shooter and they are selling their Standard M1a, it is because they never shot it much. Either way, you are getting a quality rifle (this only works for the Standard, loaded/match may be shot out, if used for competition).

Parts are easy to get and replace. With the exception of the Op Rod, reasonably priced, if you need parts.

Also, Mags: Go to 44mag.com http://www.44mag.com/products.asp?dept=1318 He is a great guy to work with! The CMI mags are current USGI and work great. If you can get the 20 round mags, they are the best price.

Good luck and feel free to PM if you have specific questions, the M1A is a rifle made for/by Riflemen, pure fun
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Old 02-08-2010, 02:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SHTF-Alerts.com View Post
Ok, I think I'm leaning towards the Standard now...... All I care about is if this gun is "battle accurate".....I'm not a competition shooter.

Also, I have another question: What are the average prices of the Standard and Loaded M1a's?

I checked on Gunbroker and elsewhere, but I cannot find enough of a sample size to accurately determine the average price of these guns. I feel that Gunbroker prices are inflated, anyway.
NIB M1A standards run around 1100 bucks in my neck of the woods, and usually dont stay on the sales racks for very long. Loaded models run arounf 3oo bucks more here. I havent run across very many used standards around here, but the rifle's I have located have not been shot very much by the looks of them. Most have been safe queens. The loaded, and NM models that I have found used were usually shot quite a bit, and sold off after thier time in competion was over...apparently.
I have found a few stds and Bush models over the years that were built with USGI parts, to include the bbls.( If you find one such as this, I would snag onto it, provided that the rifle is in good shape.). USGI std weight/contour bbls are chrome lined and sport a 1/12in twist rate) The few SAI stds I have seen recently had USGI trigger groups fresh from the factory, and everything else was SAI produced. (Note: These were actually used, but had never been fired, and were being sold with org box/manual/mag...etc..... and even had the headspace tag still tied to the trigger gaurd.)
Parts are easy to find, but run more bucks in comparison to other models.
www.sadlak.com
www.lrbarms.com
www.smithenterprise.com
www.fultonarmory.com
www.44mag.com ( Good quality CMI mags, and good folks to deal with)
If your new to the M1A, I recomend that you pick up a copy of the complete assembly guide, and owners guide. Fulton sells them, and they have some very detailed/easy to read information regarding this design.

I have also found that the std weight std contour, non chrome lined 1/11 twist rate bbls that SAI uses for thier builds to be very accurate.....example:

Both of these rifles will keep a 5 shot group inside of a 1 inch circle at 100yds consistently with the ammo they like. (This Socom prefers 168grTAP, and the Bush rifle Likes 155gr TAP. Both will most likely shoot better than this once we get our re-loading into gear, and tailor make ammo for both. )

This rifle is a "purpose built", go-to, better to have and not need than other way around, hunting rifle, more or less do anything that a centerfire rifle can do, DMR, "holy cr@p/ got it covered, and then some, M14 Tanker, and will shoot even better than the 2 SAI rifles mentioned before...

Note: This is not an SAI build. the bbl is a Criterion std contour chromelined 18.5in. ( Modern chrome lined bbls have come a long way since the 1960's, as far as accuracy goes from my dealings with um.). This rifle has an identical twin that I had custom built for me which will shoot just as good. I put 99% of the rifle pictured above together myself, based on the other.

FWIW...... This Norinco M14 will shoot 1MOA consistently. The only mod I did to it was fit it with a sythetic stock.. ( std chrome lined 1/12intwist chicom bbl)


Note: All of them across the board will shoot WIN Q3130 147gr M80 Ball fairly decent.
Note: The new SAI produced synthetic stocks are very well made IMO. They are designed for the M1A specifically, and fit very well to the rifle right out of the box. Same goes with thier handgaurds, although I prefer the Fulton HG over the other types to include USGI HG's. They seem to be just as durable as USGI synthetics, and a bit lighter on average to me at least

I think someone mentioned this before, but it is worth saying it again. This rifle was built for rifleman, and makes for a very decent, reliable, portable pkg, that is chambered in a caliber that is very effective for use at distances from the muzzle on out to the shooters max effective range. (They are very fun to shoot as well

11B
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Old 02-08-2010, 03:06 PM
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here's the holy grail of M14/M1A infomation....http://m14tfl.com.....
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Old 02-08-2010, 03:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aka"militiamike" View Post
here's the holy grail of M14/M1A infomation....http://m14tfl.com.....
A very good source of info for the M14/M1A indeed
Very knowledgable folks concerning this rifle, and all it's varients.

( I wasnt sure if it was proper to put another forum website on a thread, so I sent him a PM regarding the firing line)


Hey there MilitiaMike! How is your Sage stock holding up? Have you had the chance to work up a range report yet? I would be very interested in your findings.
11B
Old 02-09-2010, 07:30 AM
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Thanks for all of the helpful replies.....great info!

Another question: I was holding an M1a the other day, and I've noticed that my fingers get dangerously close to the opening and closing bolt group.

Have any of you heard about people losing fingertips on their left hand when using this gun?

The Garand has a similar design, but a taller stock that gives the fingers more room to grip. With the M1a, your fingers are practically forced into the action. This is my one major gripe about this otherwise great rifle.
Old 02-09-2010, 08:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SHTF-Alerts.com View Post
Thanks for all of the helpful replies.....great info!

Another question: I was holding an M1a the other day, and I've noticed that my fingers get dangerously close to the opening and closing bolt group.

Have any of you heard about people losing fingertips on their left hand when using this gun?

The Garand has a similar design, but a taller stock that gives the fingers more room to grip. With the M1a, your fingers are practically forced into the action. This is my one major gripe about this otherwise great rifle.
Never had a problem, if you have real big hands, the walnut stocks are much larger(thicker, bulkier) than the synthetic stocks, maybe see if the walnut fits you better.
Old 02-09-2010, 09:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SHTF-Alerts.com View Post
Thanks for all of the helpful replies.....great info!

Another question: I was holding an M1a the other day, and I've noticed that my fingers get dangerously close to the opening and closing bolt group.

Have any of you heard about people losing fingertips on their left hand when using this gun?

The Garand has a similar design, but a taller stock that gives the fingers more room to grip. With the M1a, your fingers are practically forced into the action. This is my one major gripe about this otherwise great rifle.
I have not heard of this from right handed people, but this may be a solution for you.......



The stock on this rifle is what SAI uses now, and has for a while. It is a Boyds stock, and the foregrip area has more of a garand contour as compared to a USGI Wood stock, which has the same contour as the synthetic USGI stocks on some of my other rifles pictured before. It is made from walnut, and has more of a Garand feel to it IMO.
Another stock that has very similar contour are the chicom (Norinco/Polytech) stocks. I have no idea what kinda wood it is made out of , but my examples are "soft" (similar to pinewood), and they are very light in weight.
USGI stocks were made out of walnut, and birch.
Note: Another stock design that is usually reffered to as "big birch" is a thicker version of a USGI std contour stock, and is sort of "in between" the thick ness of the Boyds, and USGI designs.
Note: Various aftermarket synthetics vary in this area as well, and some have a rail sytem that is usually thicker in the foregrip area, and with rails in place, a body could add a fwd pistol grip.....although I wouldnt. Be advised that the good ones are not cheap.
Note: Most of the handgaurds you will see are all synthetic, but they did make a wood (walnut) HG like the one pictured above.
Note: Custom built stocks . www.law483.com ( Tony can build about anything you want, and has a design that is purpose built in the foregrip area specifically with this in mind. amazing stuff, and might be just what your a lookin for. He can also shorten the LOP to your exact specifications, to include re mounting the M14 buttplate, an M1Garand buttplate, or whatever buttpad you like, to include adjustable LOP designs.

11B
Old 02-11-2010, 02:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fragout View Post
A very good source of info for the M14/M1A indeed
Very knowledgable folks concerning this rifle, and all it's varients.

( I wasnt sure if it was proper to put another forum website on a thread, so I sent him a PM regarding the firing line)


Hey there MilitiaMike! How is your Sage stock holding up? Have you had the chance to work up a range report yet? I would be very interested in your findings.
11B
no range report yet....but soon....i've been working like a dog lately and havent had a chance to get to the range....theres a 100 and 200 yard range session 20th and 21th of this month...I will take notes and pics for a full report....
Old 06-08-2012, 08:40 PM
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Default m1a1 loaded standard

I love my loaded standard. did not have to do a thing to it. it likes the 168 grn American eagle or federal gold metal match. shoots a 5 shot 3 inch group at 1000 feet. The extra $ is a good investment.
Old 09-20-2012, 07:53 PM
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i have been looking into buying one of these rifles, but have been unable to find much information about the loaded standard specifically. any information you could give would be much apreciated. also pictures of the gun?
Old 09-21-2012, 12:07 AM
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What makes the M-1A rifles work so well are having a decent rifle, a well trained/experienced shooter and using high quality ammunition. That high quality ammunition is awfully important for getting really good groups and consistent long range hits on target. And let's not forget about having a decent scope to use for those long range shots too...
Old 09-21-2012, 12:50 AM
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Look for an older M1A Standard with a GI barrel. This is the only M1A that has a chrome-lined bore. When I bought mine, I bought it used for $1100. It was worth it to me to get one with a CL'd H&R barrel...
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