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Old 12-10-2009, 07:28 PM
aaronbev79 aaronbev79 is offline
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Default Sawed off shotgun rules/laws?



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I've heard that it's not technically illegal to saw a shotgun, but it is illegal to have a barrel less than a certain length and a total length for the whole shotgun that is less than a certain length.

So what's my best bet for a short shotgun? I've thought about purchasing a really cheap single shot shotgun and modifying it for home defense and as a last resort short range weapon.

I would start by cutting the barrel to the minimum length allowed, and then cut the stock or grind it to a pistol grip style to get the total shotgun length to the minimum allowed by law.

Anyone know the length laws?

Anyone have any good ideas for modification?

Anyone tried a similar project?

Here's the gun that I would use for the project -- my buddy has one and it's reliable and fires every time:
http://www.ableammo.com/catalog/prod...ducts_id=84550

Should I go with a 20 guage? Or something smaller since it'll be modified for close range, and a lot of kick may not be useful?

Last edited by aaronbev79; 12-10-2009 at 07:36 PM..
Old 12-10-2009, 07:43 PM
james223 james223 is offline
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The barrel must no shorter than 18'' and 16'' for a rifle. I forget the over alll length (OAL). The shortest rifle i own is a kel tec . It is 26.5 ''
Old 12-10-2009, 07:53 PM
FrightenedWolfe FrightenedWolfe is offline
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The barrel of a shotgun must be no shorter than 18 inches.

If you go through the NFA Class III process you can have the "fun stuff" but that takes time and money.

Just get a Remington 870 with an 18 inch barrel or get a pistol in a good caliber like .45. The SBS is simply not worth the hassle.

The only other way to get a small shotgun is to get one that is classified as an AOW as that only requires a $5.00 fee, but still takes time.
The drawback to the AOW is that you will not be allowed to have a buttstock on it....
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Old 12-10-2009, 08:05 PM
aaronbev79 aaronbev79 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rifle man View Post
The barrel of a shotgun must be no shorter than 18 inches.

If you go through the NFA Class III process you can have the "fun stuff" but that takes time and money.

Just get a Remington 870 with an 18 inch barrel or get a pistol in a good caliber like .45. The SBS is simply not worth the hassle.

The only other way to get a small shotgun is to get one that is classified as an AOW as that only requires a $5.00 fee, but still takes time.
The drawback to the AOW is that you will not be allowed to have a buttstock on it....
I'm not interested in a .45 pistol cause the ammo is too darn expensive, but I do plan on owning a pistol as well.

Are there generic pistol grip stocks that can be purchased for shotguns?
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Old 12-10-2009, 08:16 PM
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1934 National Firearms Act

Categories of regulated firearms

Short barreled shotguns (SBSs) - this category is defined similarly to SBRs, but the length limit for the barrel is 18" instead of 16", and the barrel must be a smoothbore. The minimum overall length limit remains 26".
Old 12-10-2009, 08:18 PM
aaronbev79 aaronbev79 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vatrader01 View Post
1934 National Firearms Act

Categories of regulated firearms

Short barreled shotguns (SBSs) - this category is defined similarly to SBRs, but the length limit for the barrel is 18" instead of 16", and the barrel must be a smoothbore. The minimum overall length limit remains 26".
Thanks! Good to know. Anyone tried modifying a cheap shotgun for a close range, last resort weapon?
Old 12-10-2009, 08:18 PM
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And you need to measure the barrel length with a dowel down the tube with the action closed. Don't do it with a ruler on the outside of the tube.

Also you CAN have a barrel shorter than 18 inches if you pay the $200 tax stamp for it.

Last edited by vicdotcom; 12-10-2009 at 08:25 PM..
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Old 12-10-2009, 08:36 PM
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There are better choices for defensive weapons than a single shot shotgun. Better than a rock or stick, but limited. There are dependable shotguns available that are pump action and hold multiple rounds, are easy to operate, have a good after market support [pistol grips, etc] and affordable. There are others that would serve you well too, depending on how much you can spend and are able to operate. For home defense, I personally want simple. Simple and effective. Something a person filled with adrenaline and limited by darkness can operate. Recoil can be dealt with by the slightest of people with some training. I would opt for good training and the larger 12 gauge.
Old 12-10-2009, 08:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aaronbev79 View Post
I'm not interested in a .45 pistol cause the ammo is too darn expensive, but I do plan on owning a pistol as well.

Are there generic pistol grip stocks that can be purchased for shotguns?
Pistol ammo is much cheaper than Buckshot.

If you shorten a shotgun barrel less than the 18", and actually use it in a completely justified home invasion self defense, you will be strung. Don't expect sympathy from a judge or jury either. If you want a short barreled gun, pay the tax and do it right. Ever hear of Ruby Ridge? If the cops even THINK you have one, expect the swat team. And those guys shoot first and ask questions later...if you survive.
Old 12-10-2009, 08:51 PM
aaronbev79 aaronbev79 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffrey View Post
Pistol ammo is much cheaper than Buckshot.

If you shorten a shotgun barrel less than the 18", and actually use it in a completely justified home invasion self defense, you will be strung. Don't expect sympathy from a judge or jury either. If you want a short barreled gun, pay the tax and do it right. Ever hear of Ruby Ridge? If the cops even THINK you have one, expect the swat team. And those guys shoot first and ask questions later...if you survive.
Did you actually read the thread? I have no intention of doing anything illegal and everything written in the thread has to do with a legal modification. I'm well aware of the consequences of owning/using illegal firearms.

Does anyone have advice for the project? There are lots of reasons to own a single shot. First of all, they are the most reliable weapon you can own. Second, they conserve ammo. And finally, they are VERY cheap.

Last edited by aaronbev79; 12-10-2009 at 09:19 PM..
Old 12-10-2009, 09:19 PM
aaronbev79 aaronbev79 is offline
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Here's what I'm talking about almost exactly. You can purchase single shot shotguns for less than $50 used, and as you can see in this video it would be a great, cheap, reliable close range weapon that can actually be fired relatively quickly.

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Old 12-10-2009, 09:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aaronbev79 View Post
Here's what I'm talking about almost exactly. You can purchase single shot shotguns for less than $50 used, and as you can see in this video it would be a great, cheap, reliable close range weapon that can actually be fired relatively quickly.

YouTube- Sawed Off Shotgun
In a situation where you are pulling the trigger to save your life or the life of a loved one, do you really want to be limited to one round?

Or are you fishing for a grown boy toy?
Old 12-10-2009, 09:50 PM
aaronbev79 aaronbev79 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vatrader01 View Post
In a situation where you are pulling the trigger to save your life or the life of a loved one, do you really want to be limited to one round?

Or are you fishing for a grown boy toy?
Research shows that a vast majority of defensive close-range gun battles are one shot kills.

Here's a quote from one of the many articles I have read on the subject:
"Statistics clearly show that in the vast majority of cases where a firearm was used for protection, only a single shot was fired — and I guarantee that a single shot from this weapon, at close range and to the center of mass, will effectively terminate any threat sans body armor (even with birdshot)."

That said...did you watch the video? That was pretty fast reload and fire if more than one shot is required.

But yes, I'm also looking for a grown boy toy as well. This is a cheap project that I'm going to do just for the fun of it.

Does anyone actually have advice for modifying a shotgun?
Old 12-10-2009, 09:51 PM
trixie trixie is offline
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overall length has to be 27"+

i got a ?, if you have a rifled slug barrel, could you go to 16"? thats the way the law is written, thats why the judge can be sold right?

Last edited by trixie; 12-10-2009 at 10:37 PM..
Old 12-10-2009, 10:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trixie View Post
overall length has to be 27"+
Nope. 26", for both rifle and shotgun

Quote:
Originally Posted by trixie View Post
i got a ?, if you have a rifled slug barrel, could you go to 16"? thats the way the law is written, thats why the judge can be sold right?
Nope. Shotgun with rifled barrel is still a shotgun, not a rifle.

- OS
Old 12-10-2009, 11:35 PM
aaronbev79 aaronbev79 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oh Shoot View Post
Nope. 26", for both rifle and shotgun



Nope. Shotgun with rifled barrel is still a shotgun, not a rifle.

- OS
Yep...it is 26" in total length -- I just confirmed it from multiple sources.

So here's my project:

NEF 20ga single shot -- Cost: $50 used - $100 new

I'm going to saw the barrel to 18.5 inches, and saw the stock so that it puts my total length at somewhere below 27 inches.

Ebay has a cheap tactical flashlight/laser sight combo for $49/free shipping. I'll use this for a makeshift sight and the flashlight is an ultra bright led. Since I'll most likely be using spread shot, I just need the laser sight to give me a basic direction. But, honestly, I just want it for the fun of it! But believe it or not, it's actually gotten pretty good reviews. Here's a video of it:


And here's what I'll use to attach it to the barrel:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...#ht_1911wt_912

Finally, I want some way to carry extra rounds with the gun. Maybe a strap that holds shells, or one of those shell carriers that attach to the gun. I don't know. I may not have enough room after I shorten the gun.

All said and done, I should have a reliable home defense weapon for around $100-$150.
Old 12-11-2009, 12:03 AM
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So i have taken a mossberg .22 and took it off the stock a little unbalanced but tell me what you think.

also i loved the shotty video.. that was pretty cool for a single shot.
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Old 12-11-2009, 12:05 AM
aaronbev79 aaronbev79 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kroenen117 View Post
So i have taken a mossberg .22 and took it off the stock a little unbalanced but tell me what you think.

also i loved the shotty video.. that was pretty cool for a single shot.
Cool -- are you going to build a custom handle for it?
Old 12-11-2009, 12:17 AM
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i sawed off a old 16 gauge thinking wow this is awsome. then i got to the range and it was shooting to the left somehow and spread a foot every 2 feet but other than that it's a fun range toy
Old 12-11-2009, 12:40 AM
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I'm partial to the Stoeger Coach shotgun. Side by side 20 inch barrel. more pricey, but they sure look cool.
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