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Old 06-04-2012, 06:37 PM
CWhalen355 CWhalen355 is offline
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Default Pellet gun question .177 Cal at 1000 FPS or .22 at 800 FPS?



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I have recently bought a Beeman pellet gun with an interchangeable barrel. I have a .177 barrel that is good for 1000 fps or a .22 barrel at 800 fps.

I currently have the rifle scoped for the .22 barrel but wanted to know if the .177 cal would work better? I don't plan on shooting more than maybe 30-40 yards max.

So, larger .22 with lower fps or smaller .177 with higher fps?

Appreciate your feedback.
Old 06-04-2012, 10:56 PM
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The kinetic energy from the 22 would be better for hunting.
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Old 06-04-2012, 11:17 PM
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22 for serious and .17 for practice, lots of practice. It's cheaper and you can still reach out to 40 yards on a good day with minimal wind. Even better is position shooting at standard 10 meter targets, offhand, kneeling, sitting and prone. Those skills will carry over to large bore guns at a fraction of the cost for your trigger time.
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Old 06-05-2012, 06:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CWhalen355 View Post
I have recently bought a Beeman pellet gun with an interchangeable barrel. I have a .177 barrel that is good for 1000 fps or a .22 barrel at 800 fps.

I currently have the rifle scoped for the .22 barrel but wanted to know if the .177 cal would work better? I don't plan on shooting more than maybe 30-40 yards max.

So, larger .22 with lower fps or smaller .177 with higher fps?

Appreciate your feedback.
Which model Beeman did you purchase?

What type of pellets are you using? Domed pellets are generally more aerodynamic and deliver more energy to the target over distance than wad cutters, hollow or pointed tip pellets. Air rifles are finicky about what brand and type of pellet will produce accurate results.

Beeman FTS, Crossman Premiers or JSB Exacts are popular domed pellets. I suggest setting up a target and find out which barrel/pellet combo performs best at 30 yards. I prefer .177 or .20 caliber for hunting.


Air rifle targets with backstop.

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4-6 fpe at the target will kill small game. Practice the 'artillery hold' on your Beeman. If you grip the forestock too tight accuracy will suffer. Also keep in mind that the double recoil of springer air rifles plays havock with optics and mounts. Blue lock-tite those screws in your scope mount.

helpful info on all aspects of air gunning here: http://www.straightshooters.com/what-is-power.html
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Old 06-05-2012, 07:17 AM
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I too have an inter-changeable barrel Beeman.


I only keep the .22 barrel on mine. I have other .177's to practice with. Changing barrels means I have to go through the sighting process all over again.

Al
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Old 06-05-2012, 07:40 AM
CWhalen355 CWhalen355 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Al Diehl View Post
I too have an inter-changeable barrel Beeman.


I only keep the .22 barrel on mine. I have other .177's to practice with. Changing barrels means I have to go through the sighting process all over again.

What type of pellets have you had the best luck with?

Al
That's the one that I have. I've had the .22 barrel on it from day one. Never shot it with the .177 barrel. Don't want to have go through sighting in the scope every time I swap out barrels.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brazilš View Post
Which model Beeman did you purchase? Elite X2?

What type of pellets are you using? Domed pellets are generally more aerodynamic and deliver more energy to the target over distance than wad cutters, hollow or pointed tip pellets. Air rifles are finicky about what brand and type of pellet will produce accurate results.

Beeman FTS, Crossman Premiers or JSB Exacts are popular domed pellets. I suggest setting up a target and find out which barrel/pellet combo performs best at 30 yards. I prefer .177 or .20 caliber for hunting.


Air rifle targets with backstop.

Uploaded with ImageShack.us

4-6 fpe at the target will kill small game. Practice the 'artillery hold' on your Beeman. If you grip the forestock too tight accuracy will suffer. Also keep in mind that the double recoil of springer air rifles plays havock with optics and mounts. Blue lock-tite those hex screws in your scope mount.

helpful info on all aspects of air gunning here: http://www.straightshooters.com/what-is-power.html
The only pellets I've shot through it are .22 Crossman Premier hollow points. Bought a tin of 500 when I bought the rifle and have about 150 or so left.

Thanks for the advice on the blue lock-tite. The first time I shot it (maybe 50-60 pellets) I did notice that the scope had moved back quite a bit.
Old 06-05-2012, 07:44 AM
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Go here for pellets: http://www.pyramydair.com/

Buy 3 cans get the 4th free. Buy a bunch of different kinds and find out which pellets your rifle like best.

Al
Old 06-05-2012, 02:49 PM
CWhalen355 CWhalen355 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Al Diehl View Post
Go here for pellets: http://www.pyramydair.com/

Buy 3 cans get the 4th free. Buy a bunch of different kinds and find out which pellets your rifle like best.

Al
Thanks for the website. I'll have to take advantage of that deal.

Should I order different grain weights or try to order different brands with the same grain weight?
Old 06-06-2012, 06:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CWhalen355 View Post
Thanks for the website. I'll have to take advantage of that deal.

Should I order different grain weights or try to order different brands with the same grain weight?
Yes, try a bunch of them. I have good luck with the Beeman and Gamo brands. In a multi-pump like my Sheridan and Benjamin I use the Eun Jin very heavy pellets. They might be a bit much for a spring air model like yours though.

Al
Old 06-06-2012, 08:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CWhalen355 View Post
Thanks for the website. I'll have to take advantage of that deal.

Should I order different grain weights or try to order different brands with the same grain weight?
How tight are the groups with the Crossman Premier hollow points?

Crossman Premier domed pellets should group tighter, as should JSB Exacts or Beeman Field Target Specials.

I prefer testing different brands for accuracy and use domed pellets for hunting.

Unless you are buying match grade wad cutters from a company like Vogel, individual pellet grain weights will vary by as much as .5 grains.

Let's say the specified weight is 11.5 grains, the tin will contain pretty equal numbers of 11.4, 11.5 & 11.6 grain pellets and a few 11.3 and 11.7 grain pellets. There may even be some 11.2 or 11.8 grain flyers in there....I toss those. ...yeah, I weigh all my pellets.
Old 06-06-2012, 05:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brazilš View Post
How tight are the groups with the Crossman Premier hollow points?

Crossman Premier domed pellets should group tighter, as should JSB Exacts or Beeman Field Target Specials.

I prefer testing different brands for accuracy and use domed pellets for hunting.

Unless you are buying match grade wad cutters from a company like Vogel, individual pellet grain weights will vary by as much as .5 grains.

Let's say the specified weight is 11.5 grains, the tin will contain pretty equal numbers of 11.4, 11.5 & 11.6 grain pellets and a few 11.3 and 11.7 grain pellets. There may even be some 11.2 or 11.8 grain flyers in there....I toss those. ...yeah, I weigh all my pellets.
Groups with the hollow points aren't as tight as I think they should be at around 30 yards. I'd say maybe an 1-2 inches? (I haven't actually measured) But then again, I'm new to air rifles and just learned about the "Artillery Hold" mentioned in a previous post in this thread.

Watched a few youtube videos regarding it. So it might be the way I'm holding my air rifle and not the fault of the rifle itself or the pellets.

I greatly appreciate everyone's feedback on this. I was getting frustrated with the rifle and now realize "it's probably the shooter. Not the gun"
Old 06-06-2012, 06:59 PM
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As others have stated, go with a good domed .22 cal for hunting. Blue lock tight on your scope mounts will help, as will a Beeman "Scope Stop" ( http://www.beeman.com/scopeacc.htm ) installed using Blue lock tight as well. The reverse recoil on a springer is tough on scopes and mounts.

I do not know if your Beeman has an adjustable trigger, if so, play with it and find your sweet spot. I bought a Feinwerkbau from Beeman when they where in Santa Rosa, CA. and it took some 5-700 rounds before it started getting really, really accurate. Once broken in you should be able to get 30 yard groups within an inch pretty regularly.

Good Luck and Happy Hunting!

Just checked... the scope stop I linked to may not work on your rifle

Last edited by riorust; 06-06-2012 at 07:01 PM.. Reason: added info
Old 06-07-2012, 02:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kantill View Post
The kinetic energy from the 22 would be better for hunting.
I'd want to do the math on the exact pellet weights and velocities before making that claim.

Kinetic energy goes up linearly with mass, but with the square of the velocity.
Old 06-07-2012, 09:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Savinkov View Post
I'd want to do the math on the exact pellet weights and velocities before making that claim.

Kinetic energy goes up linearly with mass, but with the square of the velocity.
It was a general statement but most of the time a true one. I am sure if you played around with hundreds of combinations you could find one .177 pellet that would come close to the same energy as a .22. That being said in general the mass of the larger pellet will produce more kinetic energy than a little one moving at a slightly faster speed. For it to have more it would have to be traveling at a much faster speed to have more energy. Buy hey nice try at sounding smart.
Old 06-07-2012, 09:47 AM
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Actually we both forgot the last part of this and that it's distance. And that is when the larger mass object due to it's weight loses it energy and the smaller will have more of it's because of gravity. But since we are talking a pellet rifle and not say a 7mm or 30-06 or even the whole 9mm vs 45 I didn't think we needed to go there. Or here is a even simpler way to put this you stand ten feet from me and I start to throw rocks at you starting from very little to very big. Now at first those rocks will be moving very fast but have no real amount of mass so at first they won't even hurt but as I pick up heavier rocks the mass will go up but the speed will go down. But image that they will start to hurt and even could kill you.
Old 06-07-2012, 10:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CWhalen355 View Post
Groups with the hollow points aren't as tight as I think they should be at around 30 yards. I'd say maybe an 1-2 inches? (I haven't actually measured) But then again, I'm new to air rifles and just learned about the "Artillery Hold" mentioned in a previous post in this thread.

Watched a few youtube videos regarding it. So it might be the way I'm holding my air rifle and not the fault of the rifle itself or the pellets.

I greatly appreciate everyone's feedback on this. I was getting frustrated with the rifle and now realize "it's probably the shooter. Not the gun"
Once you're accustomed to holding the rifle as loosely as possible your groups will shrink up a good bit.

Some air rifles have zero recoil...the Pre-Charged Pneumatics (PCPs). They have an air cylinder in the stock that is filled with compressed air. Very cool and quite pricey.


The only other advice I can think of right now is to consider sending your rifle to a tuner. I don't know how much $$$ you have invested in the Beeman but having it tuned will smooth out the cocking action & reduce recoil, making it much more pleasant to shoot.

Paul Watts is a highly regarded springer tuner.

http://www.springgunning.com/

fees for an advanced tune range from $200 - $300 on most Beeman air rifles.

Dedicated air rifle forums include The Yellow or 54, GTA (gateway to airguns) and Straightshooters. You can find some pretty good deals on pre-owned air guns in the Classifieds on these sites.
Old 06-07-2012, 01:17 PM
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I have a Beeman R1 and R7.
The R1 is .22 and the R7 is .177.
the R1 is a very poor performer, in compition due to the violant spring movement.
Speed does not pay off in the long run in serious compition.
400 - 600 FPS is far more accurate and are still capable of taking small game like rabbits .
The hype about speed is nice, but in the end , if you are not hitting, you are loosing.
I participated in siliuet shooting for air guns for a while and others with the R1 had cut the barrel shorter in an effot to beat the knnetic shock of the piston slamming against the chamber . Only slight imporvment .
I weighed each round and found many hi dollar rounds varrying several grains compared to the cheaper ones. I even did resizing making special dies to insure consistancy in every single round .
That gun was a bad investment, or a good one if I considder the education I got out of it .
I have CO2 BB guns( pistols ) that take rabbits @100 feet; one shot, one kill . Their average is about 380-400 FPS.
Stand up some quarters @ 50' . What you can consistantly hit with , use it.
The spring in the Beeman is going to eventually fail and twist like a worm inside scoring the walls and deterriorating the piston effeciency no matter how much you oil it .
Pump guns are too slow for me and noisy to pump up.
CO2 and or PCP (pre charged penumatic) are very effecient and the newer guns are getting better about FPS and leakage issues , and have none of the problems the others do.
Some PCP s are up to .50 cal capable of taking buffalo.
Just cause it's air, doesn't make it a toy.
Check the reviews on "Pyramid Air" . People are honest and even blunt about the guns they get .
Plus many are repeaters theat make hunting much more fun.
Old 06-07-2012, 09:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arleigh View Post
I have a Beeman R1 and R7.
The R1 is .22 and the R7 is .177.
the R1 is a very poor performer, in compition due to the violant spring movement.
.
The R1 usually garners high marks in trade reviews,practically the same as a HW80 medium powered springer. Did you consider a trigger tune or maybe having a Theoben gas spring installed?

Since it's (the R1) a popular model it would be easy to sell depending on condition. The R11 might be a better choice for silhouette, although it is heavy, it is very accurate.



Beeman R11
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