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Old 03-08-2012, 01:05 PM
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Lightbulb Quality/value of DPMS AR-15?



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Found an excellent deal on a DPMS AR15 but unable to find any reliable sources relating to quality of workmanship/warranty, etc. I'm sure this has been debated on here before but I'm at work and barely have time to ask you fine folks about this company. Don't want to get caught searching forums on company time ya know. Just wondering if they are reliable firearms and if you guys would pay $5-600 for one if you had the money or would you put it as a down payment on something else like a Colt or some such? TIA for the help.
Old 03-08-2012, 01:16 PM
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They get a lot of bad press, mostly because of people that spend 1500 bucks on a rifle and can't stand that a 600 dollar one can be just as good.

I teach carbine classes, and they are of above average quality for sure. Not the top of the line, but if price is taken into consideration, I'd call them the best deal on the market.

Check it out, like with any AR you want to make sure that the assembly is done correctly, Even colt can get that wrong on occasion. But I wouldn't hesitate for a second.

If I was going to buy another AR today, I would probably look at the DPMS' first.
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Old 03-08-2012, 02:00 PM
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I had one for 9 years now, I have shot about 25,000 rds through it. Replaced the extractor twice and a new barrel but still shoots great.
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Old 03-08-2012, 02:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nostrings6972 View Post
Found an excellent deal on a DPMS AR15 but unable to find any reliable sources relating to quality of workmanship/warranty, etc. I'm sure this has been debated on here before but I'm at work and barely have time to ask you fine folks about this company. Don't want to get caught searching forums on company time ya know. Just wondering if they are reliable firearms and if you guys would pay $5-600 for one if you had the money or would you put it as a down payment on something else like a Colt or some such? TIA for the help.
Here are a few reads of people having common problems with DPMS,

http://68forums.com/forums/showthrea...portical-upper
http://www.mdshooters.com/showthread.php?t=22989
http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.ht...&f=66&t=465227
http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_3_118/543833_.html
http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.ht...&f=66&t=359694
http://answers.yahoo.com/question/in...3143000AAWUuCO
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubb...Number=2021723
http://www.predatormastersforums.com...Number=2168685
http://www.ak47.net/archive/topic.ht...f=121&t=508374
http://www.uzitalk.com/forums/showth...roking-problem
http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.ht...&f=66&t=444461
http://www.thehighroad.org/archive/i.../t-492387.html
http://www.zombiehunters.org/forum/v...p?f=16&t=37502
http://www.thehighroad.org/archive/i.../t-391569.html
http://calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=501822
http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.ht...f=109&t=865970
http://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb...-upper-171781/
http://m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=65729
http://beta.ar15.com/archive/topic.h...3&f=4&t=433979
http://www.thehighroad.org/archive/i.../t-162535.html
http://www.m4carbine.net/archive/index.php/t-65587.html
http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.ht...&f=15&t=352180
http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.ht...&f=15&t=329969
http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.ht...&f=66&t=499547
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/a.../t-504236.html
http://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=32398
http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.ht...&f=66&t=535535
http://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=60591
http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.ht...&f=16&t=540699
http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.ht...&f=66&t=237428
http://www.xdtalk.com/forums/ar-talk...ee-inside.html
http://www.weaponevolution.com/forum...-they-all-suck.
http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.ht...&f=66&t=535464
http://www.ar15armory.com/forums/lof...hp?t77563.html
http://thefiringline.com/forums/show....php?p=3403245
http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.html?b=3&f=4&t=556412
http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_3_121/563210_.html
http://www.snipercentral.com/forums/...ic.php?t=20485
http://www.xdtalk.com/forums/ar-talk...23-5-56-a.html
http://www.migunowners.org/forum/arc.../t-134429.html
http://www.floridashootersnetwork.co...5s-t92624.html
http://www.warriortalk.com/showthrea...ure-to-extract
http://glocktalk.com/forums/archive/...t-1402577.html
http://www.thehighroad.org/archive/i.../t-243382.html


IMO, for right around a $1000 or less, You could get a Colt 6920, Spikes, PSA, BCM. For around $1200 you can get into a Daniel Defense and for $1500-$2000 you can get a Noveske or Knights Arament.

What makes these brands, a better quality and value you then DPMS, are the materials and QC. Of all the brands listed they all,

HPT/MPI the Bolt
HPT/MPI the Barrel
Carpernter 158 Bolt steel
Shot peened bolt
4150 Barrel Steel
F-marked front sight post
Mil-spec reciever extension
Properly Staked Gas key
Properly staked castle nut
Proper M4 feed ramps
7075 Upper and Lower
H-buffer
1:7 twist barrel
Chrome lined barrel and chamber
Proper 5.56 chamber

DPMS skips these to save money. Right now the value in AR's is with Palmetto state armory where you can assemble a rifle with these features for the price of a DPMS.

Places like M4carbine.net are good places to read about M4's and thier variants.

Few prices
http://www.gandrtactical.com/cgi-bin...ction&key=6920
http://www.gandrtactical.com/cgi-bin...&key=MID-750-C
http://www.gandrtactical.com/cgi-bin...tion&key=XV-M4

Edit: I also had a DPMS and had ongoing problems with it short stroking.
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Old 03-08-2012, 03:18 PM
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I have a DPMS AR-15, never had a prob. with it. If I had the money now I'd get another one in a hartbeat. Damn good guns for the money.
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Old 03-08-2012, 03:23 PM
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My DPMS never got the memo that it's suppose to be a cr@p gun...have not had a single malfunction in it...few thousand rounds to date.


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Old 03-08-2012, 04:06 PM
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Colt AR problems
www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=17647
http://www.impactguns.com/colt-m4-ca...16in-6920.aspx
http://www.gandrtactical.com/cgi-bin...ction&key=6920

Daniel Defense Problems
http://www.survivalistboards.com/sho...d.php?t=104278
http://forums.1911forum.com/showthread.php?t=266522
www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=67179
www.ar15.com/forums/t_3_118/531028_.html

Bushmaster Problems…
http://www.virtualjeepclub.com/...17...-Bushmaster-M4
http://www.thehighroad.org/archive/i.../t-469217.html

ETC ETC ETC…

The point being, there’s plenty of problems to be found.. I’m sure I can find people that are having problems with their coffeemakers of any brand and model too.
Most of the time, the ones that claim XYZ brand is crap.. are the ones that… as I stated above, spent three times as much, and can’t stand the thought of their rifle not being three times as good. Which it normally isn’t.
You will get problems with every brand out there, some more than others. I see all brands of ar’s, Ak’s. and everything else out there come through the classes. And DPMS never stands out as anything worse than average, and in many cases, actually less problematic than average.
I sincerely doubt that you’ll be disappointed. Especially since you can get a couple thousand rounds of practice ammo in before you’re even up to the purchase price of some of the others.

If TSHTF, you can always use that practice to your advantage, and pick up an expensive one from the ones that couldn’t afford the training.
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Old 03-08-2012, 07:09 PM
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Bought my first AR about a year ago. Mainly because I figure they will be banned at some point. Not knowing anything about the AR platform, I researched various forums and discovered that you can go crazy over all the experts on what is best. I bought a Colt because it was only 100ish more than the competition in similar configurations (m4 with detachable carry handle). Figure the "Pony" will make it worth a little more down the line.

The best advice I heard was that AR's are Barbie dolls for men (and you too girls). Front rail system, add a couple hundred. Have a fixed carry handle, subtract a hundred. The model you are considering is a Barbie in flip-flops and cut-off shorts. Mine is a Barbie wearing an evening dress, and some have a Barbie complete with an entire wardrobe and tea set. Bottom line is that they are all Barbies, and truth be known, that entry priced DPMS will probably shoot just as well as my Colt.

I may get flamed for this, but just my 2cents worth.
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Old 03-08-2012, 07:22 PM
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If an AR15 is Barbie...is an AR10 a Ken doll at least?

Heh, man, honestly, as another poster mentioned...PSA is looking really great right now for the price. Mil-Spec and 600 bucks...

Then again...you don't necessarily need mil-spec depending on your wants/requirements/needs.
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Old 03-08-2012, 07:25 PM
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Oh and really while I own none of their products and don't plan to either...they must be doing something right...Up until about the last 2 years they were practically the ONLY AR15 you could ever find at vendors and they had tons of them. Nowadays the market is saturated with all sorts of brands. Personally I like to support Spikes Tactical because they are from my home state, mil-spec, and making some innovative products too (nickel boron coated bcg and probably the best lower parts kit on the market!).
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Old 03-08-2012, 07:32 PM
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Best quality for the money right now is Palmetto State Armory (PSA). They build a better rifle than DPMS, for about the same amount of money.
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Old 03-08-2012, 08:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shinnery View Post
Bought my first AR about a year ago. Mainly because I figure they will be banned at some point. Not knowing anything about the AR platform, I researched various forums and discovered that you can go crazy over all the experts on what is best. I bought a Colt because it was only 100ish more than the competition in similar configurations (m4 with detachable carry handle). Figure the "Pony" will make it worth a little more down the line.

The best advice I heard was that AR's are Barbie dolls for men (and you too girls). Front rail system, add a couple hundred. Have a fixed carry handle, subtract a hundred. The model you are considering is a Barbie in flip-flops and cut-off shorts. Mine is a Barbie wearing an evening dress, and some have a Barbie complete with an entire wardrobe and tea set. Bottom line is that they are all Barbies, and truth be known, that entry priced DPMS will probably shoot just as well as my Colt.

I may get flamed for this, but just my 2cents worth.
if you get flamed, mark that person up to the *********** patrol right away.

I've gone through all the phases. From barebones Issue configuration M-16's through the most tacticool thing you can imagine.

These days, I use basic MOE furniture, No attachments at all. Not even a light (that's another story). a combo scope and red dot for sights and buis, is all that's on there.

The only upgrade I've kept is the bad lever.

I am considering an upgrade to a mid-length, simply because my natural grip is longer than the carbine length will allow.

I've had everything from home builds to $2000 knights. And there are several things i've learned.

1. Price has NOTHING to do with reliability.
2. a $500 AR will be more accurate than you are on your best day.

3. the SUB (which really could mean) 0.9 MOA vs. 1.1 MOA argument is absolutely ludicrous. since you can't control that small a difference anyway. neither at 50 feet or 400 yards.

No one, not even the best expert, can look at the data from a gun showing rounds fired, Malfunctions, accuracy and other relevant data, and tell you if it's a cheap or an expensive gun.

So, after that rant, you are absolutely correct. It will most likely be indistinguishable from any other brand, Including your colt.

You'd have to observe hundreds of rifle from different brands before you could even start to get the overall picture, and it still wouldn't say a damn thing about any individual rifle.
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Old 03-08-2012, 09:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 84tecate View Post
Here are a few reads of people having common problems with DPMS,

http://68forums.com/forums/showthrea...portical-upper
http://www.mdshooters.com/showthread.php?t=22989
http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.ht...&f=66&t=465227
http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_3_118/543833_.html
http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.ht...&f=66&t=359694
http://answers.yahoo.com/question/in...3143000AAWUuCO
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubb...Number=2021723
http://www.predatormastersforums.com...Number=2168685
http://www.ak47.net/archive/topic.ht...f=121&t=508374
http://www.uzitalk.com/forums/showth...roking-problem
http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.ht...&f=66&t=444461
http://www.thehighroad.org/archive/i.../t-492387.html
http://www.zombiehunters.org/forum/v...p?f=16&t=37502
http://www.thehighroad.org/archive/i.../t-391569.html
http://calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=501822
http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.ht...f=109&t=865970
http://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb...-upper-171781/
http://m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=65729
http://beta.ar15.com/archive/topic.h...3&f=4&t=433979
http://www.thehighroad.org/archive/i.../t-162535.html
http://www.m4carbine.net/archive/index.php/t-65587.html
http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.ht...&f=15&t=352180
http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.ht...&f=15&t=329969
http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.ht...&f=66&t=499547
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/a.../t-504236.html
http://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=32398
http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.ht...&f=66&t=535535
http://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=60591
http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.ht...&f=16&t=540699
http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.ht...&f=66&t=237428
http://www.xdtalk.com/forums/ar-talk...ee-inside.html
http://www.weaponevolution.com/forum...-they-all-suck.
http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.ht...&f=66&t=535464
http://www.ar15armory.com/forums/lof...hp?t77563.html
http://thefiringline.com/forums/show....php?p=3403245
http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.html?b=3&f=4&t=556412
http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_3_121/563210_.html
http://www.snipercentral.com/forums/...ic.php?t=20485
http://www.xdtalk.com/forums/ar-talk...23-5-56-a.html
http://www.migunowners.org/forum/arc.../t-134429.html
http://www.floridashootersnetwork.co...5s-t92624.html
http://www.warriortalk.com/showthrea...ure-to-extract
http://glocktalk.com/forums/archive/...t-1402577.html
http://www.thehighroad.org/archive/i.../t-243382.html


IMO, for right around a $1000 or less, You could get a Colt 6920, Spikes, PSA, BCM. For around $1200 you can get into a Daniel Defense and for $1500-$2000 you can get a Noveske or Knights Arament.

What makes these brands, a better quality and value you then DPMS, are the materials and QC. Of all the brands listed they all,

HPT/MPI the Bolt
HPT/MPI the Barrel
Carpernter 158 Bolt steel
Shot peened bolt
4150 Barrel Steel
F-marked front sight post
Mil-spec reciever extension
Properly Staked Gas key
Properly staked castle nut
Proper M4 feed ramps
7075 Upper and Lower
H-buffer
1:7 twist barrel
Chrome lined barrel and chamber
Proper 5.56 chamber

DPMS skips these to save money. Right now the value in AR's is with Palmetto state armory where you can assemble a rifle with these features for the price of a DPMS.

Places like M4carbine.net are good places to read about M4's and thier variants.

Few prices
http://www.gandrtactical.com/cgi-bin...ction&key=6920
http://www.gandrtactical.com/cgi-bin...&key=MID-750-C
http://www.gandrtactical.com/cgi-bin...tion&key=XV-M4

Edit: I also had a DPMS and had ongoing problems with it short stroking.
LMAO....Like literally three of those links work. Proof...what proof.
Oh and your colts....out of stock
out of stock
out of stock
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Old 03-08-2012, 09:24 PM
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Quote:
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LMAO....Like literally three of those links work. Proof...what proof.
Oh and your colts....out of stock
out of stock
out of stock
The other night I googled all that stuff and they were working at the time. Give me a few minutes and I will repost links so they work.


As for the Colt, BCM, DD being out of stock, must mean they are a popular choice and his supply cant keep up with demand.

To further that I posted those up for a price reference.

Do you have anything useful you would like to add to this topic?

http://www.uzitalk.com/forums/showth...roking-problem

http://www.mdshooters.com/showthread.php?t=22989

http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.ht...&f=66&t=465227

http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.ht...&f=66&t=359694

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/in...3143000AAWUuCO

http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubb...Number=2021723

http://www.thehighroad.org/archive/i.../t-492387.html

http://www.ak47.net/forums/t_3_66/444461_.html&page=1

http://www.ak47.net/archive/topic.ht...f=121&t=508374

http://www.zombiehunters.org/forum/v...p?f=16&t=37502

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/a...p/t-52805.html

http://www.ar15armory.com/forums/sho...ng-t52200.html

http://www.predatormastersforums.com...Number=2169589

http://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb...-upper-171781/

http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.ht...f=121&t=496577

http://3gn.ar15.com/archive/topic.html?b=3&f=4&t=433979

http://www.thehighroad.org/archive/i.../t-162535.html

http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=450166

http://www.m4carbine.net/archive/index.php/t-82352.html

http://www.mnguntalk.com/viewtopic.php?f=52&p=191028

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/a.../t-364349.html

http://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=60591

http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.ht...&f=16&t=540699

http://www.warriortalk.com/showthrea...ure-to-extract

http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.ht...&f=66&t=535535

http://www.stoppingpower.net/forum/t...TOPIC_ID=21047

http://www.thehighroad.org/archive/i.../t-559863.html
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Old 03-08-2012, 09:34 PM
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I won 2 years ago a DPMS M4 at a gun show from the friends of the nra. I have used it in 3 gun competition and it has never failed. Once it sat 2 months and I used it without oiling it up and no problem with its operation. So in my opnion, I would get it.
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Old 03-08-2012, 09:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 84tecate View Post
The other night I googled all that stuff and they were working at the time. Give me a few minutes and I will repost links so they work.


As for the Colt, BCM, DD being out of stock, must mean they are a popular choice and his supply cant keep up with demand.

To further that I posted those up for a price reference.

Do you have anything useful you would like to add to this topic?

http://www.uzitalk.com/forums/showth...roking-problem

http://www.mdshooters.com/showthread.php?t=22989

http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.ht...&f=66&t=465227

http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.ht...&f=66&t=359694

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/in...3143000AAWUuCO

http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubb...Number=2021723

http://www.thehighroad.org/archive/i.../t-492387.html
As far as that goes I can't find a DPMS in stock anywhere along with Sw M&P, Bushmaster and half the other brands. Doesn't mean that brand is better or more popular because it's better. It just means it's a critical election year. Bo's a good AR salesman.
If you don't like DPMS I'm not going to argue. But if the op can pick up a rifle in the 5 bone range that doesn't have a million rounds through it, I would consider it. Beaters are a fun. Can't build one for that price.
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Old 03-08-2012, 09:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 777 View Post
As far as that goes I can't find a DPMS in stock anywhere along with Sw M&P, Bushmaster and half the other brands. Doesn't mean that brand is better or more popular because it's better. It just means it's a critical election year. Bo's a good AR salesman.
If you don't like DPMS I'm not going to argue. But if the op can pick up a rifle in the 5 bone range that doesn't have a million rounds through it, I would consider it. Beaters are a fun. Can't build one for that price.
Its not that I dont like DPMS, my old one was a accurate plinker/range toy with plenty of sage rat kills under its belt. But it was not a rifle I would have trusted my life with. Remeber this is a sample size of one as well, YMMV.

The OP wanted to know about quality and there are other companys that offer a higher quality product for less or the same amount of money.

PSA is the one of those options, and the build thier rifles to a designated standard that inculdes milspec features such as barrel steel and pressure testing etc. DPMS does not do these things, so from a material quality stand point PSA makes a better quality product for around the same amount of money.
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Old 03-09-2012, 02:19 AM
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Originally Posted by 84tecate View Post
Its not that I dont like DPMS, my old one was a accurate plinker/range toy with plenty of sage rat kills under its belt. But it was not a rifle I would have trusted my life with. Remeber this is a sample size of one as well, YMMV.

The OP wanted to know about quality and there are other companys that offer a higher quality product for less or the same amount of money.

PSA is the one of those options, and the build thier rifles to a designated standard that inculdes milspec features such as barrel steel and pressure testing etc. DPMS does not do these things, so from a material quality stand point PSA makes a better quality product for around the same amount of money.
So what about your one DPMS made you feel you could not trust your life to it?

Did it malfunction?
Did parts break?
Was it inaccurate?

I see lots of posters saying "quality is better on this one" etc. How does one determine that the quality is better? Just by looks? Is it the laundry list of things that they say was done to the rifle in production?

I spent a lazy afternoon at a few local gun shops "window shopping" AR's. Sure, I saw differences. Mostly in bling that was already on the rifle, weight differences, and HUGE price differences.

Not trying to pick a fight, really just curious because I've not seen that much difference in my limited experience.
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Old 03-09-2012, 06:30 AM
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Originally Posted by Shinnery View Post
Bought my first AR about a year ago. Mainly because I figure they will be banned at some point. Not knowing anything about the AR platform, I researched various forums and discovered that you can go crazy over all the experts on what is best. I bought a Colt because it was only 100ish more than the competition in similar configurations (m4 with detachable carry handle). Figure the "Pony" will make it worth a little more down the line.

The best advice I heard was that AR's are Barbie dolls for men (and you too girls). Front rail system, add a couple hundred. Have a fixed carry handle, subtract a hundred. The model you are considering is a Barbie in flip-flops and cut-off shorts. Mine is a Barbie wearing an evening dress, and some have a Barbie complete with an entire wardrobe and tea set. Bottom line is that they are all Barbies, and truth be known, that entry priced DPMS will probably shoot just as well as my Colt.

I may get flamed for this, but just my 2cents worth.
That puts it in a nutshell for me. I don't plan on leaving the cut-offs and flip flops on her either. Lol This will be my first AR and I know nothing about them is why I asked you fine folks. I bought a WASR-10 several years ago and then read a lot of bad ratings on them after the fact but have put mine through hell and not had a single misfire or problem at all. I have a friend of a friend who is a weaponsmith at the state prison here who volunteered to sew a nice evening gown and dress her up nice for me but gave no suggestions on what brand to buy.
I shied away from them in the past because I thought they were complicated little buggers to work on and maintain but, and this may sound funny, I had been catching the AR-15 Project bit on The Best Defense and they don't look that bad. Plus the fact that I think Larry Potterfield from Midwest USA could probably sell ice to Eskimos by making it look even easier to change out barrels, rails, etc helped too. lol
Old 03-09-2012, 06:37 AM
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Originally Posted by 777 View Post
As far as that goes I can't find a DPMS in stock anywhere along with Sw M&P, Bushmaster and half the other brands. Doesn't mean that brand is better or more popular because it's better. It just means it's a critical election year. Bo's a good AR salesman.
If you don't like DPMS I'm not going to argue. But if the op can pick up a rifle in the 5 bone range that doesn't have a million rounds through it, I would consider it. Beaters are a fun. Can't build one for that price.
I just found a frikkin DMPS at Wally World here for $585, Colt for around $1000! Never saw that before. They usually only carry hunting rifles and shottys. The only thing I plan on doing is putting a rail on it and some good optics for now. Not into the flashlight/laser/rangefinder/gps/bottle opener/back scratcher stuff on the darn thing. lol I saw a guy at the range a while back that had so much crap on his that he could barely hold it up to fire.
I don't see a point in that. Sorry getting off topic.
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