Do we really need chest rigs?

[MountainRecluse]

Originally Posted by Doc_Shane

LBV-88 based rig



ALICE based rig



Plate carrier rig



Different gear for different uses, although now I pretty much run the PC rig for all environments. I maintain the ability to operate on land, water (dive/swim), or by air (parachute) if necessary.

Perfect and simple. Very nice.

And what these haters don't realize is that within that entire setup, you have EVERYTHING you need within that compact and organized system.

I'm sure your hands already have memorized what pocket/pouch is what...even in the dark. THAT is a major plus for rigs. Organization and easy access is KEY...

[azb]

Like everything else, stay flexible.

Many like chest rigs because that's what they train(ed) with and they're used to them. There's something to be said for having that training and sticking to it.

I'm not a soldier, a cop, or a mercenary. I'm not going looking for a fight. I can only imagine a very few, highly unlikely scenarios where much more than a few rounds would be needed. Therefore, my focus is on other things.

Plan A for us is to bug in. So the first question is, why am I going anywhere? What am I hoping to accomplish and what are the risks? In most cases, stealth and speed are going to be my tools, and a chest rig interferes with that concept. I will be armed with weapons that I can conceal easily and totally as well as a concealed IIIa vest. I will also be wearing clothes that allow me to blend in to the area in and around my house.

I see no reason at this point for a show of force, or a for a demonstration to my neighbors that I am armed and prepared. There is little to be accomplished by this. I have already determined that I can rely on none of my neighbors for a watch or a patrol, so there's no need for them to know my state of preparedness or arming. If I strut around in bdus with a chest rig, drop leg, and an evil black rifle in full view, it will achieve nothing and possibly cause problems now, or in the near future. I don't want to alarm my neighbors, and have them point me out to gangs or law enforcement either immediately or in the distant future. And I don't want them looking to me for protection. I will help if I can, but I am only one man and my priority is my family.

So while I have a belt, and a chest rig, and several ways to carry arms and ammo, I don't foresee many opportunities to use them. I remain flexible should the situation come, but it's a low priority.

Your situation may vary. I'm just sharing my ideas and thoughts for other people to consider their own situations.

Az

[LiveHard]

For those of you who have served in combat and worn both types of LBV, ALICE, or modern plate carrier styles. What are your thoughts on each?

[Doc_Shane]

The LBV is a good rig, it allowed us to carry a little more gear off the waist line, or add more if needed. It worked particularly well in the water.

ALICE had it's drawbacks in the clips for the pouches and the fact that all gear was at waist level, I use 550 cord to attach the pouches to the belt. The worst part of Alice is the Y-Harness, it allows your gear to shift so most of us either found commercial H-harness or dug up one of the old school M1956 harnesses. My personal rig was built around a Blackhawk H gear setup, after several years with the older H Harness.

PC- the modularity and addition of the Armor plates in one package is really what I like- I can maintain the same level of protection and infinitely reconfigure the PC based on mission requirements, personal preference, etc.

Out of the three the modern gear is just better for it's versatility, but if armor is not needed or wanted I would go with the LBV.

[kenny256]

I plan on getting a 762tactical chi-com chest rig. its $55 bucks and from what I have heard is really good quality.

I dont plan on wearing one all the time, just if I have to patrol the neighborhood or need to grab some ammo quick!

[Moni1124]

Originally Posted by LiveHard

For those of you who have served in combat and worn both types of LBV, ALICE, or modern plate carrier styles. What are your thoughts on each?

I have worn the LBE (Alice load bearing equip), LBV, RACK (Ranger Assault Carry Kit or the modern chest rig), and I a prefer RACK style with mags up front. They seem easier to navigate through the woods and in and out of vehicles. The most comfortable though for long durations in my opinion is the LBE with the Y harness. If you wear the pistol belt a little loose the weight rode nice on your shoulders and the mag pouches could be positioned off to the side, which is nice when you hit the prone position, and they have very little material to hold in heat.
After some missions in an urban area I fell in love with the RACK/Chest rig. having the pouches spread out across my chest and not at my sides made getting through the tighter areas nice and seemed to have a better center of gravity with everything higher and more evenly spread out across the chest then just on my sides.
Here's a photo of my current rig, holster, blow out kit, 6 mags in 3 pouches, 2 pistol mag pouches, and a dump bag.

[Captain Bomblast]

Originally Posted by MountainRecluse

I carry plenty of other necessary things on the rig itself to include a pack. You plan on bringing a backpack along too I hope....



Lol. OK. You'll be singing a different tune when pinned down by a group of gang-bangers and you're all by your lonesome....

I live in the NE as well and everyday I can go to certain parts of certain areas where there are whole packs of feral miscreants causing all sorts of criminal trouble and we aren't even in SHTF yet! Imagine when the po-po ain't there to scare those 15 rabid muts away......I'll take 210 over 90....yeah...my rig is designed for it...it's going to have it...



Or you can man up a bit, try out some pull-ups and push-ups.....standard combat loadout 210 rounds of something like 5.56 or 5.45 SHOULD NOT be burdensome on top of other gear especially when it's snuggly attached to your core with a rig....yes, I wake up EVERY morning planning on a gunfight. Survival is a lifestyle, bro. I have a wife and 2 small children to worry about. I can't afford NOT to be in a survival mindset 24/7. They mean way too much to me.



I see you live in New York.......nice little liberal mindset they worked ya into, eh? In an actual gunfight......ESPECIALLY in a SHTF scenario where baddies will be travelling unabated in larger groups......you'd be suprised how quick 90 rounds can go. Not to mention, what if you get cut off from your BOL for whatever reason....going to wish you brought some extra ammo.....definitely more than 90....are you a female? Are you 12?





That's just reality. How's about instead of knocking you actually learn something from many folks with many experiences....



Dude, 180-210 rounds is bare minimum. Seriously. You mention patrolling....210 rounds is STANDARD military patrol round count for an individual Marine/Soldier. There is nothing "extra" about 210 rounds. I wouldn't personally go more than that considering all the other stuff I need to hump....but never know if you're gonna be cut off...maybe permenantly.....why WOULDN'T you consider taking that into consideration?

Again, as I have mentioned many other threads...this is a major reason why I chose the smaller caliber rounds. Weight IS a definite issue. However, if you can't comfortably hump 210 rounds of 5.56 in PMAGS on a chest rig along with a pack and your rifle.......I would suggest you start getting in better shape.

Just my opinion based on my experiences both in and outside the Marines. If you want to stow away 5 rounds in a baggie stuffed where the sun don't shine and call it a day...then by all means do it. But don't come on here knocking folks who clearly know alot more than you when it comes to being properly prepped for gunfighting and self-defense....


"USARNG 10th Mtn Division "....National Guard? That explains ALOT...

I'm just kidding, bro. Semper Fi. Tsk, tsk....I thought someone like you would know better....I guess we just do things more hardcore in the CORPS....ah well. So where do you put your mags? Wait...probably velcro'd to your arms or something.....I know how much you Army fellas LOVE that velcro.....

Yeah, I've seen "the Corps" train... they might need twice the ammo... got to have something to fill up all the space where their skill ought to be. Training often with regulars from the 10th Mtn. was not a waste of time at all... even though I was only lowly NG.

Liberal? Yeah, OK... all of New York is not New York City, bonehead! I ran into too much of that attitude in the south. Nebraska? Really? Not exactly the highest crime rate out there. Nice country... and one of the lowest population densities of any state... gang-bangers? Yeah, OK.

I was only offering my 'survivalist' opinion regarding carrying a combat load of ammo post-SHTF. But, yeah, I guess if you live in gang banger land, Nebraska, you might be justified carrying your body weight in bullets. I guess I'm just not in the right mindset to survive. I have a family as well and believe me, we will not be knocking on your door for anything... you'd probably shoot us all at 400yds before we got there anyway.

[MountainRecluse]

Originally Posted by Captain Bomblast

Yeah, I've seen "the Corps" train... they might need twice the ammo... got to have something to fill up all the space where their skill ought to be. Training often with regulars from the 10th Mtn. was not a waste of time at all... even though I was only lowly NG.

Liberal? Yeah, OK... all of New York is not New York City, bonehead! I ran into too much of that attitude in the south. Nebraska? Really? Not exactly the highest crime rate out there. Nice country... and one of the lowest population densities of any state... gang-bangers? Yeah, OK.

I was only offering my 'survivalist' opinion regarding carrying a combat load of ammo post-SHTF. But, yeah, I guess if you live in gang banger land, Nebraska, you might be justified carrying your body weight in bullets. I guess I'm just not in the right mindset to survive. I have a family as well and believe me, we will not be knocking on your door for anything... you'd probably shoot us all at 400yds before we got there anyway.

Hey now.....don't get your panties all up in a bunch now......your 10th mtn buddies carry the same loadouts.....I'm talking about a permenant BO situation on foot....not walking 10 yards to your garden to get a tomato....

[MountainRecluse]

Originally Posted by Captain Bomblast

Yeah, I've seen "the Corps" train....

No you haven't.

[Doc_Shane]

Captain Bomblast-

You obviously either saw a pogue or reserve unit or have never seen real Marines.
Even with the M16A1 and A2 we were still shooting on the long known distance ranges out to 800m, and most Marines could still hit the targets at that distance with iron sights way before all the gizmos came into fashion.

[JoeKan]

Originally Posted by Doc_Shane

LBV-88 based rig



ALICE based rig



Plate carrier rig



Different gear for different uses, although now I pretty much run the PC rig for all environments. I maintain the ability to operate on land, water (dive/swim), or by air (parachute) if necessary.

Thanks Doc, great set up.

[Captain Bomblast]

Originally Posted by MountainRecluse

Hey now.....don't get your panties all up in a bunch now......your 10th mtn buddies carry the same loadouts.....I'm talking about a permenant BO situation on foot....not walking 10 yards to your garden to get a tomato....

Just bustin. My 10th Mtn. buddies were more inclined to strip their gear down to the minimum needed... not to carry 80+ lb. load. I was always impressed by their ability to get by with less, in favor of mobility. I saw (and still see) Marines humping an absurd amount of gear, to the point of absurdity... looking like if they had to get into prone, they would be rolling around trying to get back up. Forget sprinting. I've read many accounts (written by Marines) about the overloading of infantry... about the ineffectiveness of carrying too much weight into a combat situation.

The OP -I believe- wasn't talking permanent BO. If bugging out for the long term , then yeah, I'll agree, carry as much as you can... maybe carry more than practical and stash some gear/ammo in a safe place. From what I gathered, he was talking about patrolling his land, not going on a shopping mission in downtown LA.

[TDFbound]

Originally Posted by MountainRecluse

So where do you put your mags? Wait...probably velcro'd to your arms or something.....I know how much you Army fellas LOVE that velcro.....

Real men use buttons. Semper Fi.

[mac1020]

I look at at chest rig a lot like a tool belt. I wear a tool belt every day at work, and after years of working with it i don't even have to look to grab the right screw driver, nut driver, dykes, etc. I am a lot more efficient with it. If it ever gets to a bad enough point where I am armed with my rifle all the time you had better bet I will be wearing my chest rig, the last thing I would want is to get in a shoot out and reach for a mag in my back pocket only to find that they had fallen out somewhere along the way.

[ShiaSurvivor]

What do you all think about a Turkey vest?

I know they dont hold mags, but I think it would work well for someone just using stripper clips with all the pockets.

[Doc_Shane]

I don't see why it wouldn't work, if that it what you want.

It's a lot less "militant" looking than a lot of other options.

[ShiaSurvivor]

Originally Posted by Doc_Shane

I don't see why it wouldn't work, if that it what you want.

It's a lot less "militant" looking than a lot of other options.

Definately why I considered it.

If shtf I will be bugging in and if required, wearing hunting camo.

[Doc_Shane]

Originally Posted by ShiaSurvivor

Definately why I considered it.

If shtf I will be bugging in and if required, wearing hunting camo.

The main reasons I use what I have is that I have it still............................ and each rig is burned into muscle memory.

[FWFRazorX]

Im going with a chest rig to hold AR mags. I want quick access to them. As for being concealed and blending in, I dont see it happening. If you have even a suitcase or a grocery bag someone will want it and you will be a target. I will take my chances on appearing as a threat but hope to be able to bunker down but if I have to bug out, Im using my vehicle until I have to walk then will stay off the road

[drobs]

I have a Black Hawk Omega mag vest bought a few years ago cheap.
It can carry either 12 AR mags or 6 AK mags.

What's nice about it is it evenly distributes the weight of your gear and feels very light weight when you wear it.

Since working the last 2.5 years as a contractor in Iraq (see my office below)

I'm contemplating ceramic plates & and carrier with mag pouches.

Figure if you wake up to something, why not pull on some armor?
Why not have every possible advantage?
Why limit yourself?


I think at minimum a couple sets of LBE belts, mag pouches, and harnesses would be a good idea.