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Old 01-10-2012, 10:39 PM
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Default How to tell if Colt A2 buttstock is authentic?



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Is there any way to tell if a Colt A2 stock is an original Colt part? Are there any markings or stamps that should be on the stock or any other parts of the assembly that would set it apart from any of the other manufacturers?
Old 01-12-2012, 09:28 PM
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None that I'm aware of.
Old 01-12-2012, 10:00 PM
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If you are buying look for the overinflated pricetag........

Colt doesn't make a lot of their parts, they use the same forges and parts suppliers that every one else does.
There are a few companies that make most of the AR parts out there, the "manufacturers" just finish machining and add their roll marks.
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Old 01-13-2012, 05:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doc_Shane View Post
If you are buying look for the overinflated pricetag........

Colt doesn't make a lot of their parts, they use the same forges and parts suppliers that every one else does.
There are a few companies that make most of the AR parts out there, the "manufacturers" just finish machining and add their roll marks.
Doc, after asking several people and posting the question on other forums, I'm under the impression that you're absolutely right. I'm guessing that there is one or two manufacturers that are supplying A2 stock assemblies to all of the rifle companies and aftermarket vendors.

After hearing that Colt makes the best A2 stock, I was able to find a few dealers advertising them for about $130. The problem is that they, and just about every other dealer selling non-Colt A2 stocks, were using the exact same file photo of the stock on their website. All of the other sites were selling what was probably the exact same item made by the same manufacturer as the 'Colt', but for about half of the price. Most of the sites were selling A2 stocks but were not even indicating who manufactured it.

As far as I can tell the Colt stocks do not even have a stamp or mark to differentiate between them and any stock sold by any other vendor. Someone indicated that early Colt models (1960's M16s ?) had a "C" stamped on the right sight of the stock, but current models have no marking. Maybe Colt initially made their own stocks but eventually outsourced them to ACME company?

Even if all stocks are made by Acme brand and Colt puts their rollmark on it (which I don't believe they do), I can't see spending $130 for a 'Colt' Acme brand stock when I can buy an 'RRA' Acme brand stock for $70.

If this is accurate then shame on the vendors for advertising an Acme brand stock as a Colt for twice the price as the same thing you can get from the vendor next door. If this is not the case and there actually is a Colt brand stock, then someone please correct me.
Old 01-13-2012, 05:10 PM
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Originally Posted by GramercyRiff View Post
Doc, after asking several people and posting the question on other forums, I'm under the impression that you're absolutely right. I'm guessing that there is one or two manufacturers that are supplying A2 stock assemblies to all of the rifle companies and aftermarket vendors.

After hearing that Colt makes the best A2 stock, I was able to find a few dealers advertising them for about $130. The problem is that they, and just about every other dealer selling non-Colt A2 stocks, were using the exact same file photo of the stock on their website. All of the other sites were selling what was probably the exact same item made by the same manufacturer as the 'Colt', but for about half of the price. Most of the sites were selling A2 stocks but were not even indicating who manufactured it.

As far as I can tell the Colt stocks do not even have a stamp or mark to differentiate between them and any stock sold by any other vendor. Someone indicated that early Colt models (1960's M16s ?) had a "C" stamped on the right sight of the stock, but current models have no marking. Maybe Colt initially made their own stocks but eventually outsourced them to ACME company?

Even if all stocks are made by Acme brand and Colt puts their rollmark on it (which I don't believe they do), I can't see spending $130 for a 'Colt' Acme brand stock when I can buy an 'RRA' Acme brand stock for $70.

If this is accurate then shame on the vendors for advertising an Acme brand stock as a Colt for twice the price as the same thing you can get from the vendor next door. If this is not the case and there actually is a Colt brand stock, then someone please correct me.
Capitalism my friend. Can't fault a vendor for that. Shame on the buyer for not researching his/her purchase. And yes, they are from just one or two manufacturers. Just like most lower and upper receivers come from the same forges. Colt outsources the little stuff, like all the other manufacturer's. Colt isn't a plastics manufacturer, so they outsource the stocks...
Old 01-13-2012, 06:37 PM
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It's called "OEM" supplier- say I need 100 stocks and I want them made with my stamp on it, that's exactly what I get when they are shipped to me. Same thing as everyone else has but with the name I want on them.

Like Magazines, the ones with Colt on the bottom are made by NHMTG and Okay Industries who also mark the same mags for Colt, Bushmaster, RRA, etc. Same product different price based on what name is on it.

Tons of industries do it.
Old 01-13-2012, 10:11 PM
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And nothing wrong with it. If a company is willing to back their sub-contractor by putting the companies logo on it, more power to 'em. But IMO there is no reason to pay more for a stamped stock. I am always more interested in who made the barrel, but I'm not a collector.
Old 01-14-2012, 11:50 AM
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I don’t have a problem with companies adding their stamp, roll mark, label, etc. to a product and selling it as their own. I realize this is a common practice. For example, I am under the impression that many different companies’ lower receivers are made by the same factory and then have their roll mark added. I’ve been told that Stag and Noveske lowers are identical except for the markings and a consumer is paying almost twice the price for the Noveske because of the name. If someone wants to pay extra for the Noveske label, that’s fine. If someone didn’t do their research and paid extra for the Noveske because they thought it was better than the Stag then shame on the consumer. That is capitalism, I get it.

However, since I have been doing my research, I have found no one who can tell me that the ‘Colt’ A2 stocks have any markings whatsoever. Maybe they are unmarked but are sold in a Colt brand box or package? Even if the stocks are unmarked but Colt sells them directly from their website, I can understand them being sold as ‘Colts’.

My problem is that it seems the stocks being sold by aftermarket vendors as ‘Colt A2 Buttstock’ are unmarked, unlabeled generic stocks that everyone else is selling as ‘A2 Buttstock’ for half of the price. If I decided I wanted a Colt stock, whether I was aware that all stocks are actually manufactured in the same facility or not, and I receive a generic unmarked A2 stock in the mail, I’d be ****ed and I think most other people would be too. That’s not capitalism, that’s basic misrepresentation. Simply put, a lie.

Again, if the Colt stocks do have some marking to identify them as Colts, I have no problem with that.
Old 01-15-2012, 01:31 AM
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Years ago Diemaco (now Colt Canada) made stocks, they were marked CS, and are pretty rare and collectible nowadays.

I see what you are saying that some unscrupulous dealers may take a part and claim it is a Colt part and sell it for more even though it is a generic version that everyone uses.

It happens which is why the buyer has to be extra careful when looking at higher end parts and make absolutely sure you know what you are looking at (forge marks, stamps, etc.).

What you describe happens all the time.
Old 01-29-2012, 09:52 PM
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Default Just bought a Colt A2 Butt Stock set on eBay

Been looking for a awhile now for a good A2 rifle butt stock set for an FN M16A2 clone that I'm putting together. There's a lot of "Leepers" brand A2 stocks being offered all over the place but I think that those are made in CHINA.

Did see some closed out ADs offering used Colt A2 stocks having a designation of "CS" stamped someplace on them.

Back in the 1980s as a DOD materials analyst and purchasing agent, I worked for a time at a subsidiary manufacturing company of Winchester in Hingham, Massachusetts. At the time, they had a contract making M16 rifle finished aluminum forgings for Colts Firearms Div. Those were both upper and lowers that were totally drilled, machined, polished and finished. The lowers were roll stamped for Colt and serial numbered in the white. After that, the lower and upper receivers were coated.

So . . no Virginia, Colt M16 rifles are not expertly fabricated by Sam Colt's old world skilled gnomes toiling deep within the bowels of ancient brick buildings somewhere in Hartford, Connecticut.

The stuff is farmed out to everybody and anybody who can meet the basic spec for the best per piece delivered price. That's it!
Old 01-29-2012, 10:09 PM
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Default Just bought a Colt A2 Butt Stock set on eBay

Been looking for a awhile now for a good A2 rifle set for an FN M16A2 clone that I'm putting together. There's a lot of "Leepers" brand A2 stocks being offered all over the place but I think that those are made in CHINA.

Did see some closed out ADs offering used Colt A2 stocks having a designation of "CS" stamped someplace on them.

Back in the 1980s as a DOD materials analyst and purchasing agent, I worked for a time at a subsidiary manufacturing company of Winchester in Hingham, Massachusetts. At the time, they had a contract making both M16 rifle finished aluminum forgings for Colts Firearms Div. These were both upper and lowers that were totally drilled, machined, polished and finished. They lowers were roll stamped for Colt. and serial numbered in the white. After that, the lower and upper receivers were coated.

So . . no Virginia, Colt M16 rifles are not expertly fabricated by Sam Colt's old world skilled gnomes toiling deep within the bowels of ancient brick buildings somewhere in Hartford, Connecticut.

The stuff is farmed out to everybody and anybody who can meet the basic spec for the best per piece delivered price. That's it!
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