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Old 02-04-2011, 02:19 AM
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Default Mid Range Tactical Rifle



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If you could choose one, what would you choose between these two rifles for mid range (200 - 600 yards) SHTF in partial forest and open fields/bodies of water:

Remington 700P Custom w/AICS

Calibre: .308

Barrel Length: 26"

Action Type: Bolt Action

Finish Type: Matte Black Finish w/ Olive Drab Furniture

Optic Sight: Bushnell Elite 6500 (2.5-16x42) with Sun Shade, 30mm Tube, and Side Focus. Scope also features RainGuard HD.

Grip Style: Thumbhole Stock

Included Accessories: Comes with Harris Bipod, Badger Ordnance Scope Rings, Bushnell Elite 6500, 40X Trigger, AICS Stock in OD Color

or

DPMS Panther Arms LR-308 SASS

Calibre: .308

Barrel Length: 18"

Action Type: Semi Automatic

Finish Type: Matte Black w/ Black Synthetic Furniture

Sight Type: Fold Down Iron Sights

Grip Style: Standard Pistol Grip

Magazine Capacity: 5 Rounds

Included Accessories: Rifle Comes with full rail covers, Two Magazines, Magpul Buttstock, and Rifle Carrying Case

Last edited by Jafo67; 02-04-2011 at 02:19 AM.. Reason: Spelling errors
Old 02-04-2011, 03:50 AM
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What do you consider mid-range?

It looks like DPMS intended this to be a "long range" weapon since the name is "Semi Auto Sniper System". Being an 18" barrel however, "your experiences with it at long range may vary". An 18" barrel is plenty to stabilize the .308 round, but I would likely call this one a mid-range rifle. 300-600 yards should be no problem at all for this rifle.

The 26" bolty should be more accurate at all ranges, but you might feel more secure with an auto-loader for SHTF.
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Old 02-04-2011, 03:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffrey View Post
What do you consider mid-range?
Sorry, I added the info after seeing your post.


"If you could choose one, what would you choose between these two rifles for mid range (200 - 600 yards) SHTF in partial forest and open fields/bodies of water."
Old 02-04-2011, 04:12 AM
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Its apples to oranges
You stack one and the other is striped? WTF
Is this the way you have them or are you trying to load a question?
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Old 02-04-2011, 04:17 AM
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If the DPMS accomplishes what it was intended accuracy wise, it would be more accurate than 75% of American gun owners anyway. So for SHTF- get an accurate MBR, which this IS.

For a bolt action, look at the Browning X-Bolt instead of that remy. I guarantee its gonna be more friendly to use.
Old 02-04-2011, 04:26 AM
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Uncle Bob, you have asked the question I asked. I was having a discussion with a guy at work who "knows his guns" about the different versions of Remington 700's, their uses (hunting/police/military) and was told flat out that the DPMS was superior to the any Remington 700 out there.

He sent me to an online store that had these two models listed in the exact configs I posted. The difference is $100. His logic is the DPMS is that much better stripped than the Remington. Not knowing much about this style of rifle, I thought I'd post here and get some "ammo" to back with.

Here is the DPMS link

http://www.wolverinesupplies.com/def...id=12&pid=1612

and the Remington link

http://www.wolverinesupplies.com/def...id=12&pid=1441
Old 02-04-2011, 04:30 AM
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But Remington is not a top quality maker either.
Old 02-04-2011, 04:39 AM
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Quote:
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But Remington is not a top quality maker either.
So, he is right then?
Old 02-04-2011, 04:45 AM
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I have not fired the DPMS SASS, so dont know. I do know that browning makes a more accurate rifle than Remy. Remington is a mid-line rifle that is affordable to most, more accurate than some shooters, and available to all at wallmart. It's the AK47 of bolt actions.

If you were to compare the SASS to a long barreled X-bolt, the results just might flip. Either way, it looks like the SASS is fine for what you want. Pricey, but fine.
Old 02-04-2011, 04:47 AM
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Whoa whoa whoa, $3k each for the SASS or Remington? WTF PASS on both.

For $3k get a standard R-25 AND a Browning X-bolt!
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Old 02-04-2011, 05:08 AM
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Do you have a bolt now or semi auto? I would go with the one I don't have yet.
Old 02-04-2011, 06:10 AM
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Get some 20 round magazines to use in the DPMS SASS and you have what the military is using as a sniper rifle except their version uses a 20 inch barrel. Actually, I would go with a Rock River LAR-8 rifle so that I could use the cheaper FN/FAL rifle magazines. It looks like the DPMS, same caliber and is also an accurate rifle too. Scope either the DPMS or the LAR-8 and you can't go wrong.
Old 02-04-2011, 06:39 AM
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Out of those two chooses I would look at the DPMS

The thump hole stock is a issue for me. I can shoot ambidextrously, but I am faster and more accurate shooting left. I like for all my weapons to be ambidextrous.

For me the semi auto would provide faster follow up shots and plenty of accuracy for my needs and ability.
Old 02-04-2011, 07:33 AM
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Don't quite consider 600 yards "mid range", but I guess that's just me.

What exactly would you be shooting at these ranges?

I would go with the DPMS if the choices are limited to these two. JMHO
Old 02-04-2011, 07:37 AM
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While Remington 700 would not be my first choice I would have to take it over the AR for several reasons. Gas operated weapon systems are going to be a "pain" to keep going because of the gas residue (carbon) build up in them and this will give you problems if you don't keep them VERY CLEAN they will stag on you.

As well if you happen to take a bad fall with a AR you can wind up with a two piece pile of parts. i.e. horse fall, slip getting in truck, slip on incline, etc.

For the kind of money you are talking I would build one with a proven battle rifle action and that would be the 1903 Springfield with a McMillan stock, stainless 12 twist 26" medium Palma contour barrel. There is far less to go wrong with one of these and require no special tools to work on them in the field.

For instance if you need to pull down a 700 bolt you need a dime or washer. To replace the striker spring (have seen such break) you need a special tool.

For the 1903 you just rotate the safety to 12:00, unscrew it for access to the striker, release the tension, depress the collar and off comes the striker spring, replace with a new one, install the collar and you are good to go.

The 1903 trigger has a spring, sear, sear pin, trigger, trigger pin. Never seen/heard of it happening but if you need to replace the sear spring you take a medium nail, remove the trigger pin, this releases the sear spring, do so and reassemble and you are good to go.

You break and extractor just remove bolt, rotate extractor, push off, push on a new one and you are good to go.

The same thing goes for a 98 Mauser. Both are proven "winners" on many battle fields.

Plus you can carry the spare parts in a small roll in your pack and keep it going for years in the field.

If you are hell bent on dropping big bucks pull up

http://www.deathfromafar.com/htm/08_...recision.shtml

These will fly with the best of them. I have known Norm Chandler many years from when he was with the Sniper School at Quantico and shot with him when he was on the Marine Corps Rifle Team. The guys he employs are all retired from Quantico Marine Corps shop and they are the same guys that build the M40A2/3s so you are getting basically the same rifle the Scout Snipers use.

I have a friend who has two of them. One already has 10,000 + rounds on it and it is still doing fine.

For the scenario you envision the 1903 was/ would be my first choice.

You can hit me with a PM if you want more details.
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Old 02-04-2011, 09:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffrey View Post
Whoa whoa whoa, $3k each for the SASS or Remington? WTF PASS on both.

For $3k get a standard R-25 AND a Browning X-bolt!
I looked at the X-bolt. Very nice in the composite stalker. And why a R-25? I like that model, and am curious for your reasoning.

BTW, thanks to all for the great responses.
Old 02-04-2011, 11:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jafo67 View Post
Uncle Bob, you have asked the question I asked. I was having a discussion with a guy at work who "knows his guns" about the different versions of Remington 700's, their uses (hunting/police/military) and was told flat out that the DPMS was superior to the any Remington 700 out there.

He sent me to an online store that had these two models listed in the exact configs I posted. The difference is $100. His logic is the DPMS is that much better stripped than the Remington. Not knowing much about this style of rifle, I thought I'd post here and get some "ammo" to back with.

Here is the DPMS link

http://www.wolverinesupplies.com/def...id=12&pid=1612

and the Remington link

http://www.wolverinesupplies.com/def...id=12&pid=1441
Rem and DPMS are owned by the same people.
The barrels most likely come from the same building.
As far as the action Bolt is more often than not more repeatable.
They are both OK weapons. What matters is the job at hand. Do you or do you not have need of a quick follow up shot.

One more thing. In your original post you said you were comparing rifles. Not true, you were compairing weapons systems. (Accessorized weapon)

One more reason to go Bolt over a standard ar10/r25 With a suppressor the bold will be much quieter. That is unless you spring for a selectable gas block.
Old 02-04-2011, 12:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jafo67 View Post
I looked at the X-bolt. Very nice in the composite stalker. And why a R-25? I like that model, and am curious for your reasoning.

BTW, thanks to all for the great responses.
The R25 comes with camo and a 20" floated SUB-MOA barrel for $1200. With its solid foregrip, you can drill to add a small rail if you want without having uncofortable quad rails. Forget the sling stud on the bottom, thats for your bipod. Install a sling loop or stud on the side.

It's not the best trigger out there, but thats easily fixed.
Old 02-06-2011, 05:48 AM
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I dont even know where to begin on some of what's being written here.

Overall, I'd choose practice if I was worried about 200-600m shots.

But....

Given your choice, as listed, between these 2 and 200-600m requirements, the 700 because it includes optics.
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Old 02-06-2011, 05:54 AM
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Mid range??? Did i Miss Something... ak or My Fav. 556 sig.?
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