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Old 12-18-2010, 08:44 PM
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Default HEADS UP: ATF making a move before new Congress convenes .....



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I received this from a distributor we buy from occasionally - checked it out - it is completely legit. More will be coming out in the following days but consider it just another dirty trick being tried under the cover of the holidaze and before the new Congress convenes ....

The following is the result of a document written by the ATF on 14 December 2010 (this past Tuesday) and released to the media via BATFE Public Relations late afternoon, after close of business, this past Friday 17 December 2010. In turn, the NSSF became aware of it Friday night and it was subsequently released to all members of the NSSF at 2100 hours this past Friday, 17 December 2010. It was strategically released by the BATFE at such a time as to receive minimum exposure and not until Congress had adjourned. There will only be three total so-called working days for Congress to react to this latest anti-gun initiative over the holidays before the regulation is enacted and before the new Congress will convene and conduct their first business. This is pure dirty tactics and it is a slap to the face to the pledge of so-called "transparency" the current administration promised.

Quote:
This is a special notice to warn you of impending new gun regulation. The ATF has proposed to require gun dealers to provide directly to the ATF the names, addresses, and serial numbers for every purchase of two or more semi auto, mag fed rifles within a five day period!! They are trying to force this in by January 5th, without any approval from Congress, calling it a needed "emergency" regulation. This is backdoor registration of guns and gunowners.
Here is a quote from the notice by the NSSF (National Shooting Sports Foundation) regarding this burdensome and illegal move:

"The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF) is moving to require federally licensed firearms retailers to report multiple sales of modern sporting rifles beginning January 5, 2011. Specifically, the ATF requirement calls for firearms retailers to report multiple sales, or other dispositions, of two or more .22 caliber or larger semi-automatic rifles that are capable of accepting a detachable magazine and are purchased by the same individual within five consecutive business days."
We are encouraging everyone to contact the relevant officials to protest this move. The office that approves regulation changes like this that bypass Congress is the Office of Information and Regulation affairs of the DOJ and they can be reached at 202-395-6466. You can call your Senator and Representative at the US Capitol switchboard at 202-224-3121.

The NSSF offers the following points to make when calling

1. "Multiple sales reporting of long guns will actually make it more difficult for licensed retailers to help law enforcement as traffickers modify their illegal schemes to circumvent the reporting requirement. Traffickers will go further underground, hiring more people to buy their firearms. This will make it much harder for retailers to identify and report suspicious behavior to law enforcement."
2. "Long guns are rarely used in crime (Bureau of Justice Statistics)."
3. "Imposing multiple sales-reporting requirements for long guns would further add to the already extensive paperwork and record-keeping requirements burdening America’s retailers – where a single mistake could cost them their license and even land them in jail."
4. "Last year, ATF inspected 2,000 retailers in border states and only two licenses were revoked (0.1%). These revocations were for reasons unknown and could have had nothing to do with illicit trafficking of guns; furthermore, no dealers were charged with any criminal wrongdoing."
5. "According to ATF, the average age of a firearm recovered in the United States is 11 years old. In Mexico it’s more than 14 years old. This demonstrates that criminals are not using new guns bought from retailers in the states."
6. "Congress, when it enacted multiple sales reporting for handguns, could have required multiple sales of long guns – it specifically chose not to."

Read the full notice by the NSSF here:
http://www.nssfblog.com/atf-to-requi...for-long-guns/

Read the full ATF document proposing this illegal move here: (PDF)
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv...uments/atf.pdf
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Old 12-19-2010, 12:43 AM
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Correct me if I'm wrong....I believe they already do something similar to this with handgun purchases...
Old 12-19-2010, 12:47 AM
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this was already posted
 
Old 12-19-2010, 12:59 AM
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Yes Peter but that was an act of congress and they specifically exluded long guns from that bill. Congress was bypassed this time, just as they were bypassed in the appointment of this new Director.

Figured we'd see this and worse from an anti-gun recess appointment. Andrew Travers is the new sneakily appointed Director of the ATF. Formerly the SAC for ATF's Chicago field office.
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Old 12-19-2010, 01:02 AM
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How many more threads are we going to start on this?
Old 12-19-2010, 08:28 AM
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I had not seen it. I don't read this board as much as I used to.
This is far more important that BS threads about how many guns you are going to walk to your bug out location with.


Old 12-19-2010, 01:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crazycanuk View Post
this was already posted
No, it wasn't and no, it hasn't. Link to it if that is the case.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Survivalguy72 View Post
How many more threads are we going to start on this?
Link to some of those "many more threads" will you please?

This is important information that has just been updated and released in the past 48 hours ... matter of fact, it was just released at 2100 hours on the 17th of December, less than 48 hours ago. It is something that some of us would like to be made aware of - I know I was - and I suspect there are others like me as already illustrated in this thread.

The ATF wrote the document on the 14th of December and released it to the media on the morning of the 17th. The NSSF released it en masse to all of us at 2100 hrs this past Friday evening. Yet you claim it has been posted many times around here?

So, I'll ask both crazycannuck and you Survivalguy72 again ... please link to other threads in this community where it has been posted prior to this one if you will.

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Old 12-19-2010, 02:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Survivalguy72 View Post
How many more threads are we going to start on this?
As many as it takes!

This is nothing more than a back door mandatory gun registration and a blatant attack on the Second Amendment!


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Old 12-19-2010, 02:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SIXPACK View Post
As many as it takes!

This is nothing more than a back door mandatory gun registration and a blatant attack on the Second Amendment!


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I have to agree, Sixpack! The furtive and sneaky way the ATF is going about this, is the REAL worry. Makes me think that the ATF is approaching the out of control behavior that the IRS pulls on we subjects of the USA.
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Old 12-19-2010, 03:00 PM
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And this is new behavior for the BATF&E how? I seem to remember a bunch of burned-to-death kids in Waco, and their patty-paws were all over that one too. They don't mind killing, they'll lie to get their way, and the Constitution they swear oath to protect and uphold is nothing but toilet paper to 'em. They need to meet the Declaration of Independence for a change.
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Old 12-19-2010, 03:25 PM
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Once again we see a one size fits all approach to a problem they refuse to deal with directly. I suspect whats driving this has a lot to do with stemming guns being illegally smuggled in mexico and used by cartels. Mind you this is just a guess, yet two and two together...
If this is the case then those of us who have no desire other than to purchase and legally own semi auto firearms are being winnowed for evidence of trafficking...nice
Old 12-19-2010, 03:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by desert wanderer View Post
I have to agree, Sixpack! The furtive and sneaky way the ATF is going about this, is the REAL worry. Makes me think that the ATF is approaching the out of control behavior that the IRS pulls on we subjects of the USA.
I had a run in with the "atf" in 2005 when they harassed law abiding citizens in an effort to destroy the gun show industry, I ended up testifying against those agents and their agency at a Congressional hearing in 2006. These thugs, as they can be called by no other name, decided on their own that harassment would become, and I'm quoting the lead atf agent in Richmond Virginia, "the way the atf operates across the country."

I watched and listened with great concern as traver was nominated by obunghole to head the atf, and I've been following this new development with even more concern for the last couple days. As a gun owner, but more importantly a freedom loving American who believes in what the Constitution stands for, I understand the long lying implications that this will bring about........

I fear that the proverbial line in the sand is being drawn, and like I always figured it to be, it isn't the people who are doing it.......


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Old 12-19-2010, 03:30 PM
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Where's Amal Ulrik when you need him?
Old 12-19-2010, 03:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter View Post
I suspect whats driving this has a lot to do with stemming guns being illegally smuggled in mexico and used by cartels.
Look Peter, please do a little research on this!

Americans cannot purchase RPG's, full auto AK's, full auto AR's, M60 machine guns, etc., etc., in the numbers these cartels are getting them in. Have you ever seen the price of a Class III transferable firearm?? They're far too expensive for even the drug cartels to find profitable.

The way the leftist libtards padded their numbers in the "amount of American weapons" that "found their way over the border", was to include M16's that the United States government had sold to the messican government, which these cartels had gotten through corrupt means in their own country! This doesn't count all of the other weapons these cartels import from other countries. It's all just bullsh*t to appease the libtards and their "feel good" agenda's.

Make no bones about it, the atf, backed by the current "administration" is declaring war on any American who believes in the Constitution and what it stands for.....


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Old 12-19-2010, 04:06 PM
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The BATFE, DHS and DEA all have way too much power and need to be scaled back. No agency should have the ability to deem something illegal or contra and without the approval of Congress.
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Old 12-19-2010, 04:38 PM
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The BATFE, DHS and DEA all have way too much power and need to be scaled back. No agency should have the ability to deem something illegal or contraband without the approval of Congress.
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Old 12-19-2010, 09:40 PM
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I still say our government should put the effort into sealing the border and not this bs against gun owners....
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Old 12-20-2010, 12:35 AM
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..........................................?
Old 12-20-2010, 01:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter View Post
Sixpack,
To say that small arms (NOT! RPG's full autos etc.) from the US are not finding their way into the wrong hands and eventually to mexico is akin to putting the blinders on.

Does this kind of illegal activity happen to the extent that the MSM says it does? I doubt it. Is it happening to the extent that new laws and expanded ATF powers need to be brought to bear. I don't think so.

As I understand this law (if it passes) gives the ATF an opportunity to screen those peope who buy two or more semi auto rifles within a one week period. The ATF has not to my knowledge explained why they feel the need to do this.

Where is this promised transparency in government. It's just not there, neither is the proof of a problem that requires a new law and expanded power.
Im sure theyre using the Mexico smuggling as an excuse but are more concerned with the growing popularity of survivalist and militia websites.

Remember, survivalists are stereotyped right up there with extremist militia groups and hate groups. As far as the government is concerned there is no difference between the members of this board and David Koresh and Timothy McVeigh. And with the growing number of people getting involved in these sites, they are scared there will be a public uprising against them and they may just be outgunned. So now theyre pushing something they know wouldnt pass under normal circumstances so they can at least know whose door to knock on before that uprising begins.
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Old 12-20-2010, 01:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SIXPACK View Post
The way the leftist libtards padded their numbers in the "amount of American weapons" that "found their way over the border", was to include M16's that the United States government had sold to the messican government, which these cartels had gotten through corrupt means in their own country! This doesn't count all of the other weapons these cartels import from other countries. It's all just bullsh*t to appease the libtards and their "feel good" agenda's.
The way they cheat the numbers is by using the term "registered firearms" 90 whatever percent of registered guns seized were from the us... all this proves is we register our guns and other nations don't. When you look at the total number of guns and the total from the us we appear to only supply 17%.
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