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Old 09-21-2010, 12:31 PM
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Originally Posted by tankman1989 View Post
My point was that there isn't much that can be done on a personal level. I can think of only a few things that the average person can make with gold or silver and that is jewelry, silverware, light reflector (mirrored silver), dental work (gold). I know that both have a lot of uses in industry, especially silver in electronics.

AS far as copper you can make tools from it much easier than you can steel if you are doing cast work, and don't need the strength of steel. It seemed to work for centuries (bronze age) and can also be made into brass.

The thing is about the pennies is you can actually make money by sorting them. I got about $200 of pennies and sorted them in about 4-5 hours. When I was done I had about 50 lbs of copper pennies out of the ~123 lbs total. That is $73.70 in face value of pennies and I have the remaining $126.30 in pennies to cash in. The 50lbs of copper pennies is worth about $176 so add this to the 126.30 remaining and it comes out to $302, which is a nice $102 profit in just 4-5 hours. $20-$26/hr

I feel confident that the price of copper will soon go higher, maybe to the $5 mark. At that rate, those pennies will be worth $250 and my time will have been worth $176 for 4-5 hours or $35-$44 / hr!

If you are interested in this, you can buy an automated coin sorter for not too much, some can do 18,000 per hour! If all things were equal to the above numbers then you would be making $147 per hour (at $5/lb copper)!
It is illegal to deface or destroy currency. Unless your melting it down yourself, and selling copper bars, your 100 pennies will always only be worth
$1. nothing more. and if your caught, then you can face stiff fines, etc..

An interesting idea, but needs to be worked out a bit.

As a SHTF idea its great. copper will be very valuble as a trade item, or to make simple tools and machines.

As a money making plan NOW, it kindof stinks as mentioned above. Although the churches in our area have been having the copper roofing stolen for about the last three years. same with manhole covers. they just go missing and get ( i assume ) sold for scrap.
Old 09-22-2010, 10:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Sgt.Sausage View Post
If I've got, say, $10,000 to invest -- I can buy $10,000 worth of gold or $10,000 worth of copper. In either case I've invested 10 grand. Sorting through the pennies to find the true copper ones, hauling, running around to find enough pennies, and the hassle of storage ... it's not worth the couple of hundred extra bucks. I have much better things to do with my time that are worth, in the long run, far more than I'd make on ripping copper pennies.

If you bought 10,000 dollars worth of gold, how much gold do you have?

The answer is 10000 dollars worth.


If you buy 10000 dollars worth of copper, specifically 10000 dollars worth of pennies, how much copper do you have?

The answer is 22331.90 dollars as of right this minute.


A ryeldale machine can go through 10000 dollars worth of pennies in a few days.

I don't know about you, but for me, its worth 3 or 4 days of my time to make 13000 dollars.
Old 09-22-2010, 11:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by countryboy123 View Post
If you bought 10,000 dollars worth of gold, how much gold do you have?

The answer is 10000 dollars worth.


If you buy 10000 dollars worth of copper, specifically 10000 dollars worth of pennies, how much copper do you have?

The answer is 22331.90 dollars as of right this minute.


A ryeldale machine can go through 10000 dollars worth of pennies in a few days.

I don't know about you, but for me, its worth 3 or 4 days of my time to make 13000 dollars.
unfortunatly penys are only copper clad now they are zinc that would be 2.5 metric tonns of pennys and roughly 5000 in zinc and a few hundred dollers in copper at todays spot price


1793–1857 100% copper
1857–1864 88% copper, 12% nickel (also known as NS-12)
1864–1942 1946–1962 bronze (94% copper, 6% tin and zinc)
1943 zinc-coated steel (also known as steel penny)
1944–1946 brass (94% copper, 6% zinc)
1974 Experimental aluminum variety
1962–1982 brass (95% copper, 5% zinc)
1982–present* 97.5% zinc core, 2.5% copper plating
Old 10-04-2010, 02:25 AM
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Gold/Silver is almost like an international currency... Not so much for copper though... I know most of you probably would wanna stick around in America but just for a second let's think that the poles somehow somewhat shifted and North America is the new North Pole... Are you gonna stick around? I saw in couple postings that people even think toilet paper is going to be a tradeable item... You know, some people in other countries don't give a sh*t about copper or toilet paper...
Old 10-04-2010, 08:05 AM
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Originally Posted by antivirus4u View Post
Gold/Silver is almost like an international currency... Not so much for copper though... I know most of you probably would wanna stick around in America but just for a second let's think that the poles somehow somewhat shifted and North America is the new North Pole... Are you gonna stick around? I saw in couple postings that people even think toilet paper is going to be a tradeable item... You know, some people in other countries don't give a sh*t about copper or toilet paper...
I have been seriously looking into Uruguay as a viable BOL
Old 01-30-2013, 08:12 AM
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If you're going to put *something* away as a hedge against inflation, commodity price increases, whatever, doing either nickels or pennies can make sense.

And for me, pre-zinc-planchet pennies (the pre-1982 ones) make far more sense than nickels. You can see why I think that in the thread here:

"Pennies instead of Nickels"

http://www.survivalistboards.com/sho...d.php?t=169558

Most who argue about the value of nickels versus pennies do so either because they don't want to spend the time to get the more investment-effective pennies, or simply drink the Rawlesian kool-aid. Rawles doesn't want people to stock pennies because, well, he advised nickels.

Now, if you absolutely don't have the time to do the penny thing, nickels are better than nothing. But in the end, pennies are the more effective investment device. Oh, there are also those who will argue nickels store better, and in terms of their face value, they do; but in terms of their MELT VALUE, they don't. And in the end, it's melt value that is the issue, not convenience of storage.


I've done the penny thing, and still do. I can see, in a penny cup at a register, which pennies are "old" and which are "new," and do so with astounding accuracy. The new pennies often have an almost pink hue, and the rims on even slighly worn new pennies don't show up as pronounced as the 95-percent copper pennies.

And one really interesting thing about pennies is this: I'm not too worried about a thief stealing my pennies. If it were gold or silver, sure, but pennies are...heavy. Right now, pennies are worth...a penny. So no thief is likely to get much more than a backache trying to steal them.

FWIW: Check out Ebay to see what these copper pennies are going for. It's astounding that you can already see people willing to buy pre-1982 pennies for more than face value. Here's an auction with 3 hours to go where $100 face in such pennies is going for $148--plus shipping! I've seen $15 worth go for $25 plus shipping lately.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/100-Face-Val...item2a28800b9b

I *could* sell mine this way...but it's not time yet. I believe that at some point the mint will stop producing pennies, and we'll be allowed to melt them down. When copper gets up in the $4-4.50 range, those pennies' melt value will be 3 cents apiece. I'm waiting for better than that.

Last edited by goose3; 01-30-2013 at 08:45 AM.. Reason: Forgot to include the Ebay link
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Old 01-30-2013, 09:14 PM
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Are you allowed to sell money on ebay? I'm not too familiar with the rules. I know you can buy collectible money, like shipwreck coins and silver notes, just didn't know about straight money.


Quote:
Originally Posted by tankman1989 View Post
My point was that there isn't much that can be done on a personal level. I can think of only a few things that the average person can make with gold or silver and that is jewelry, silverware, light reflector (mirrored silver), dental work (gold). I know that both have a lot of uses in industry, especially silver in electronics.

AS far as copper you can make tools from it much easier than you can steel if you are doing cast work, and don't need the strength of steel. It seemed to work for centuries (bronze age) and can also be made into brass.

The thing is about the pennies is you can actually make money by sorting them. I got about $200 of pennies and sorted them in about 4-5 hours. When I was done I had about 50 lbs of copper pennies out of the ~123 lbs total. That is $73.70 in face value of pennies and I have the remaining $126.30 in pennies to cash in. The 50lbs of copper pennies is worth about $176 so add this to the 126.30 remaining and it comes out to $302, which is a nice $102 profit in just 4-5 hours. $20-$26/hr

I feel confident that the price of copper will soon go higher, maybe to the $5 mark. At that rate, those pennies will be worth $250 and my time will have been worth $176 for 4-5 hours or $35-$44 / hr!

If you are interested in this, you can buy an automated coin sorter for not too much, some can do 18,000 per hour! If all things were equal to the above numbers then you would be making $147 per hour (at $5/lb copper)!

I'm with pammygene, sendkeys, mikek and kidcanada, and I haven't seen a response yet. I don't follow you, do you intent to smelt them down and sell them for scrap? That's illegal. You mention both: making tools and things, but you also focus on the hard monetary value

Or are you talking about holding onto them for their metal value after a collapse?




[quote]Aluminum will be another story. A lot of people don't realize what it takes to get aluminum. Boxite ore would be extremely difficult to refine post shtf. There is a reason the Washington Memorial was capped with 100 oz of aluminum. At the time (1884) silver and aluminum sold at the same price (1 dollar per oz)
The Hall–Héroult process permanently collapsed the price of aluminum. However, in a TEOTWAWKI world, the mega voltage required to smelt aluminum will preclude the production of aluminum and it's back to the ultra expensive processing methods. A few tons of aluminum stock stands to be worth a lot in that time.[quote]

By cwi555 ^^^

That's why aluminum is the only thing really worth recycling nowadays. Most if not everything else costs too much money to recycle, vs just making new stuff. Aluminum is too 'hard' to get out of the earth to just throw it away.
Old 01-30-2013, 09:32 PM
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ANOTHER old thread bought up. Guess what? In an economic collapse I dont want your pennies or nickles! In reality neither will anyone else.

This is that guys first post, he is after you tube hits, thats all. Thanks for playing.
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Old 01-31-2013, 12:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sigmund View Post
ANOTHER old thread bought up. Guess what? In an economic collapse I dont want your pennies or nickles! In reality neither will anyone else.

This is that guys first post, he is after you tube hits, thats all. Thanks for playing.
The problem is you NEED a medium of exchange, otherwise bartering becomes difficult. For example, I'll take silver for a generator, then I can take the silver and buy a gun, but finding someone who has a gun for sale and ALSO needs a generator is tough.
Old 01-31-2013, 02:34 AM
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Some people seem to think they are worth more than face value...

http://www.ebay.com/csc/Coins-US-/25...H_Sold=1&rt=nc
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Old 01-31-2013, 10:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sigmund View Post
ANOTHER old thread bought up. Guess what? In an economic collapse I dont want your pennies or nickles! In reality neither will anyone else.
My pennies are protection against a specific variation of SHTF event, one involving primarily hyperinflation. The pre-1982 pennies are mostly COPPER and if we hit a hyperinflation scenario, that copper value will spike. The feds will stop making pennies as with hyperinflation, what good will they be? You'd need a wheelbarrow's worth to buy a loaf of bread.

But the copper in copper pennies? Priceless!

If we have a total collapse, well, they won't be that useful. But I have other preps for those other scenarios.
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Old 01-31-2013, 11:13 AM
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I did notice one thing recently and that is they old coins are disappearing quickly these days. My dad was a collector of coins and I still have his collection (do not intend on selling it because it was my Dad's). the same thing holds true for the old Nickels. Over the last few weeks I am seeing only the new crap out there. GB
Old 02-01-2013, 11:27 PM
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You can still find a few 40% half dollars if you get a case. Not many. Not enough now to make it worth my while...
Old 02-01-2013, 11:37 PM
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The bottom of my gun safe is weighted down with wheat pennies. I never got around to the nickels. I think that is a mistake. I have a hoard of silver dimes. My silver halves and dollars are collection.
Old 02-02-2013, 11:04 AM
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I wouldn't waste my time with pennys. I'd rather go mow someones lawn and take the money and buy an ASE.
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Old 01-29-2015, 02:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tankman1989 View Post
I don't see them stopping the manufacture of pennies of nickels. Also, it depends upon what you are doing as to if pennies or nickels are better. I would need 5x as much money to work with nickels as well.

$1 of pre 1982 pennies = 303 grams of copper = $2.35 @ 3.52/lb
$1 of nickels = 75g ($.581) copper and 25g ($.56 worth)nickel = $1.14

So, it looks to me that the pennies are a MUCH better store of value than the nickels.
Which do you think is better?
U$ CENTS ˘ (Pennies)... No doubt about it!
BUT Nickels do not have to be sorted, no work involved. J.Kyle Bass "bought" $1,000,000 of U$ Nickels,
and he is financially smarter than anyone on here, Especially the nay-sayers

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xelera View Post
The nickels... EVERY nickel you get will have copper and nickel... so $1 of nickels = 1.14 in metals, EVERY TIME. The pennies, you may or may not get any pre-82 in a roll. I sort mine, just for fun, and get about 10% on average, though lately with all the new design pennies flooding the nation, it's getting lower and lower.
So even if you got, say, 33% (WAY GENEROUS ASSUMPTION) of pennies as pre-82 pennies, your $1 of pennies is under 80 cents of copper. You are losing more than you are spending. Use my 10% and now you are looking at about 24 cents earned for every dollar spent. Nickels are still worth more than face value at present.
At The Moment, Pennies are well ahead of nickels, which is USUALLY the case. PLUS, I am still getting an average of over 20% in a roll. I get rolls quite often, and have only had 1 roll with No Copper, EVER. But I ask for old re-rolled pennies. New Mint Rolls will have all zinc, obviously...
Now, if you just take a few minutes each week and save all your nickels, sort and save your pre-82 pennies, on change received, and then put your dimes/quarters back into circulation (or do what I do, and save them to buy silver eagles) then it's all profit, though not the lofty investment you predicted above.
(RE: last part)...EXACTLY! I do the pocket-change-Shuffle, every week, all the time. I occasionally add in a few rolls of ˘ents, and nickels. I sort my nickels if it is not a "mint roll" and I almost always find a Pre-War Jefferson, sometimes a WW2 "Silver War Nickel" or even a Buffalo Nickel! I also save any 1946-1959 nickels because it is said they are more rare, I know I find them rarely... but the Pre-war, non-Silver nickels are actually worth more than the Silver War Nickels as "numi's" in most any condition. They are rare because nickel was being used for the war effort.

Quote:
Originally Posted by pudding7 View Post
Exactly. In the "Economic Collapse" scenario, what industry is still around to use the industrial metals? What company is still making copper pipes for houses and buildings that aren't being built?
And even if some companies are still in business and using these metals, how exactly are you going to get in touch with them to sell your pennies? Do you live next door to such a company, because if not then are you going to use your precious gas to drive across town/state to knock on their door and say "please buy my pennies"
Gold, silver, copper only have value if someone is willing to buy it. In the SHTF scenario, who are your buyers and how will you contact them?
You Are Totally missing the point... What most financial folks think, other than paid shills for the "barbarous relic bunch" that hate Gold and Silver, and by extension, Copper is this: People will revert to Barter, #1, and back to hard money that they have on hand. It happens every time. As SHTF subsides, and order is reestablished, real money (coin) will be accepted everywhere. And even a "penny" will once again buy something, if it is Copper. There are complete communities forming tha are currently working to set up for AFTER SHTF and they are pushing HARD for Copper, as well as Silver and Gold. To ignore these values as REAL MONEY is setting one's self up for a much harder After Party @SHTF than is necessary.
But I firmly recommend real physical preps FIRST and Foremost, like Water, Food, Fuel, Protection, and them maybe stack some real money if you can. Gotta make it through, first!

Quote:
Originally Posted by cwi555 View Post
As for the value of silver and gold, It will definetly be there. History has proven that emperically. There are those who doubt, but to each their own. I am confident they will be sucking wind for that belief in the end.
+1x10^999999....
Can't say that enough!

Quote:
Originally Posted by dethmaul View Post
Are you allowed to sell money on ebay? YES I'm not too familiar with the rules. I know you can buy collectible money, like shipwreck coins and silver notes, just didn't know about straight money.
Some idiots actually collect $1,000 Bills, paying up to $2,000 for a piece of paper that will have $0.00˘ value in the near future. I have a friend who got one for FACE Value, hoping he has sold it by now. His wife worked at the bank
I'm with pammygene, sendkeys, mikek and kidcanada, and I haven't seen a response yet. I don't follow you, do you intent to smelt them down and sell them for scrap? That's illegal. You mention both: making tools and things, but you also focus on the hard monetary value
Or are you talking about holding onto them for their metal value after a collapse?
REAL MONEY VALUE, not "metals value" People will accept Gold Silver, and real copper ˘ents, I'm betting
the farm on this. But I also have the real physical preps covered as well. Gotta be able to defend your stack





Quote:
Aluminum will be another story. A lot of people don't realize what it takes to get aluminum. Boxite ore would be extremely difficult to refine post shtf. There is a reason the Washington Memorial was capped with 100 oz of aluminum. At the time (1884) silver and aluminum sold at the same price (1 dollar per oz)
The Hall–Héroult process permanently collapsed the price of aluminum. However, in a TEOTWAWKI world, the mega voltage required to smelt aluminum will preclude the production of aluminum and it's back to the ultra expensive processing methods. A few tons of aluminum stock stands to be worth a lot in that time.
Quote:

By cwi555 ^^^
That's why aluminum is the only thing really worth recycling nowadays. Most if not everything else costs too much money to recycle, vs just making new stuff. Aluminum is too 'hard' to get out of the earth to just throw it away.
If Copper was "not worth recycling" they would not do it. PERIOD.
Aluminum is not smelted with "mega-volts", it is high AMPERAGE that is used to melt the ore and burn out the impurities and oxides. Recycled Aluminum is already refined, saving the high cost steps. Just re-melt and pour!
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
Current Values of U$ ˘ents:
1909-1982 Cent (95% copper) *
$0.01 FACE
$0.0165331 Metals Value
165.33% of Face Value

Current Values of U$ Nickels:
1946-2014 Nickel
$0.05 FACE
$0.0391274 Metals Value
78.25% of Face Value
But Nickels have been up near 7˘ metal value, like when J. Kyle Bass grabbed 20 Million of them :D
It will always be worth 5˘, and even more if we have a hyperinflationary U$D crash.
U$ ˘ents (most 1982, and prior) will be always worth at least 1˘ or more if the U$D crashes.
All you gotta do is sort pocket change, but it is not a "get rich" method, quick or slow
Just another easy, quick, do it and forget it, no lose prepping strategy.
I have saved over 40# of copper cents, which is a nice compliment to my 30# of Silver, if I
hadn't had that boating accident. Anyone want to retrieve it for me, I have GPS coordinates?

Last edited by undeRGRönd; 01-29-2015 at 11:48 AM.. Reason: added info
Old 01-29-2015, 08:59 PM
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Well, we collect copper(81 or older), as a side thing, there are people who will buy them for more than face value.

Money's money!

Cat and Sleepy Turtle in Seattle
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Old 01-29-2015, 09:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by plantguy View Post
I wouldn't waste my time with pennys. I'd rather go mow someones lawn and take the money and buy an ASE.
Nothing Wrong With THAT! Everyone has their own priorities. I use the regular Quarters and Dimes and pennies for 3 things usually:

1. More Penny Rolls and Nickel Rolls
2. Ammo and Gun Money
3. Buying Silver

I'm just trying to dispel some of the bad info here that might dissuade someone from doing a simple, quick and easy prepping technique that may make a good difference after SHTF. But, Do Not Obsess over stacking Pennies! It's just a little additional helper.
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Old 01-29-2015, 09:23 PM
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I do the same UnderGround. Save nickels and pre-1982 pennies. If I'm just sitting around relaxing, I'll grab some pennies and separate the good ones.
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Old 01-29-2015, 09:30 PM
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[quote=LadyFenix;1932911]
Quote:
Originally Posted by pammygene View Post
ok I get the whole idea that the copper is worth more than the actual penny right now, but you cant take a bucket of pennies to a salvage yard to scrap for copper, it is aganist the law, so are we talking about using the copper later on our own under the radar?? I mean because the monetary value is mute point if you cant cash them in for that, if need be....or am I missing something[/QUOTE

**************************************

That was my thought, too.......that metal salvage dealers wouldn't take the pennies and give you cash for the scrap value of them. Stuff is only "worth" what you can get someone to pay for it. In this case, those "wheatie" pennies are currently only "worth" one cent. Coin dealers are probably not interested in purchasing them......because they already have a big stock of pennies, and the common dates of these don't sell at high prices to collectors.
Actually, the going rate on ebay is at least $0.02 for every copper penny sometimes more.
http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from...nnies&_sacat=0
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