Support Hobby Lobby & The The 1st Amendment.

[DBR]

Originally Posted by 9111315

Get off the troll wagon. No one is opposed the use of hormonal medications for the treatment of medical issues.

It's is about condoms, birth control pills, and plan B for free to prevent pregnancy rustling from recreational activities.

And you really must be crazy if you think anyone is going to deny you your Midol.

This doesn't have anything to do with cramps, using Midol. She outlined some very real medical issues and she is not being a troll at all.

[ActionJackson]

=Msurvivalist;5060161]Sex is part of a normal relationship, and not everyone wants children. I agree people should pay for their own BC, but it is that or an AB, which would you prefer? You want to get up in arms about an AB, but when people try to prevent it, you block that as well.

If they don't want a baby then they can pay for their own BC. It's not another person's (or business owner's) responsibility. As for the other, this forum doesn't allow us to discuss it but I have some VERY strong feelings on that subject which I shall refrain from discussing. In either event ... if a person is "responsible" enough to have sex then he, she, or it should be "responsible" enough to face the consequences of their own actions.

Why should someone be subject to a company's religious beliefs, if they don't believe them themselves? If people want to believe in the Bible or whatever, that is fine, but don't try to force it on others.

Why should an employer be subject to an employees non-religious beliefs? If folks choose not to believe in the Bible (or whatever) don't try to force their disbelief on others.

[Madcow]

Originally Posted by Msurvivalist

Sex is part of a normal relationship, and not everyone wants children. I agree people should pay for their own BC, but it is that or an AB, which would you prefer? You want to get up in arms about an AB, but when people try to prevent it, you block that as well.

Why should someone be subject to a company's religious beliefs, if they don't believe them themselves? If people want to believe in the Bible or whatever, that is fine, but don't try to force it on others.

They are not forcing anything on any one (Hobby Lobby that is). AB's are already paid for by the government, even the churchmarm conservative Govt funds them. Again, by law, until the last two communist rulers of this country (yes, dubya is a communist scum bag) an employer was only required to pay you a wage for the work you do. If the employee, or their children can keep their legs closed, or buy a condom for a whopping 30 centavos, then its on the individual. So in short, this here-

[QUOTE]Why should someone be subject to a company's religious beliefs[QUOTE]

Is not whats going on, what is going on is generational welfare recipients are robbing their employers. Hobby lobby and birth control is just the start. Soon fatty's will be able to get liposuction and have all the skin that was occupied by lard removed as well as other plastic surgery. Viagra is already covered buy most as well as other stupidity. No, this is a companies being hijacked by a rulers attempt to pay off his supporters with the welfare they want.

[Madcow]

Originally Posted by Mark Fisher

Have you been to Hobby Lobby and looked at the labels. Nothing but cheap Chinese junk in those stores. I think they are more concerned about their profits then Christian values.

You could say the same if you took a walk through any members living room, and has nothing to do with the topic.

[ActionJackson]

Originally Posted by Mark Fisher

Have you been to Hobby Lobby and looked at the labels. Nothing but cheap Chinese junk in those stores. I think they are more concerned about their profits then Christian values.

A business owner has every right to make a profit. They wouldn't be in business for long if they didn't (and their employees would be completely unemployed and without medical insurance). For all we know ... the Chinese products they're selling were manufactured by a Chinese Christian.

[Eugene]

Originally Posted by Mark Fisher

Have you been to Hobby Lobby and looked at the labels. Nothing but cheap Chinese junk in those stores. I think they are more concerned about their profits then Christian values.

6 of the 7 items I bought today say Made in USA on them. My son has the 7th someplace so I can't check it. I'm a careful shopper, if it doesn't say made in the USA on the package I put it back and look it up on the internet later.

[maine-marine]

This is my thinking...

If a business wants to allow smoking or not allow smoking, pay or not pay for certain benefits, or wants to be open on sunday, or closed on the sabbath... that should be their decision.

As long as they are providing or not providing the same level of benefits to ALL their folks and they are treating everybody the same.

Your (our) decision is to work for them or to not work for them....shop there or not shop there.

[ActionJackson]

=DBR;5060279]My Wife has them and without birth control pills, she would be facing the removal of one ovary or worse. To be blunt about it, she is 41 now and her days on birth control are numbered because of her age, it's not good for women over 40 to be on birth control for years on end...but that's how it is being suppressed and kept under 10CM now. She had them so bad that they performed an appendectomy eight years ago because it is so painful and oftentimes presents as appendicitis.

Are you saying that BC pills are potentially poisonous? Sounds like all of those television drug commercials. A drug helps one symptom but creates a hundred other, more dangerous ones. Wouldn't it be safer to find an alternative to BC pills in the first place? How about naturalistic remedies?

I don't think that employers, pharmacists or doctors should have to Rx or supply, specifically the abortive mentioned in the article. When I read "contraception," I think of hormone treatment or condom or spermicide, etc., not the "morning after pill" which is an abortive.

All of that having been said, employers that refuse to provide birth control medications for therapeutic reasons outlined above? Sue them into bankruptcy.

^^^Coming from a pro-union, business-hater^^^

Are you not aware that when a business goes bankrupt that ALL of its employees are now ex-employees without any form of insurance? Is forcing them into bankruptcy a really wise alternative or are you simply allowing your liberal knee to jerk?

[Resto]

I work for the Fed and we are not alowed to talk about God, but that doesnt bother me.
If Hobby Lobby did not offer health Insurance before OCare, then I doubt this is about Religeous Beliefs. People rarely start a bussiness out of religeous beliefs, people start bussinesses to make money most often. Dont get me wrong, I dont think a bussiness should be forced to provide Healthcare for thier employees, but I have little respect for those companies that could have aforded a health insurance plan for thier employees and did not provide it or at least share the cost, because of greed. I think Ill do some research on Hobby Lobbys profits and how much the company is worth before I make up my mind about them. We dont have a Hobby Lobby here anyway.

Personaly, I dont care about a persons sexual conduct outside of thier employment, its not my bussiness. I leave those things to God. I dont think a health insurance company should be providing funds for imoral conduct. I was kind of shocked that my health insurance pays for Viagra,cialis and lavetra. I found out becuae a co worker had the same Insurance as mine. He was not married, he had health issues that concerned that area of a mans life. He got alot of free samples and offered it to the guys at work, I think he was selling the stuff.
He died at work last year, bad scene. I had to empty his locker and it was full of cialis samples. It did not keep him alive.

[maine-marine]

Originally Posted by DBR

Can you please post the information, the drug and delivery system, the actual therapy for this?

I could post 50 links but best bet is to google "non birth control medicine for XXXX" where xxxx is the problem.

(I am not trying to cop out of answering but there is not one site that is geared for all problems)

The issue in many cases for BC pills is that the hormones are much higher then those that could be prescribed for the problem at hand. Also long term use of regular BC pills has a higher rate of problems with blood clots and other side effects.

[Madcow]

[QUOTE]Are you not aware that when a business goes bankrupt that ALL of its employees are now ex-employees without any form of insurance? Is forcing them into bankruptcy a really wise alternative or are you simply allowing your liberal knee to jerk?[QUOTE]

Folks with that mentality never think that far. They have not felt the full effects yet. When this kicks in, and their bosses decide they need to dump that guy
who runs that machine needs to be let go so they can fund the other employees reproductive rights then it will be a bit clearer for them. Thats when you will see them rioting in the streets, or waiting in line for their hand out.

[9111315]

Originally Posted by DBR

This doesn't have anything to do with cramps, using Midol. She outlined some very real medical issues and she is not being a troll at all.

. . . and no one is denying the use of BC meds for off label use. Why? Because they can be very effective at treating other medical conditions and improve the quality of life.

There is not war against woman and no one wants to deny any medications for your wife's condition.

That is what the troll wagon has to do with this and that is my troll wagon comment has more relevance to not paying for birth control medications and devises to be used for the prevention of pregnancy than does your wife's medical condition.

Your Wife's condition is a straw woman argument that has noting to do with the discussion. In fact, it is the only ones proposing cutting of your wife's treatment are the leftist woman out there -- they are the enemy. If you cannot see that, you need to check the second box on line 39a of your form 1040.

There is no argument. No one supports elimination of your wife's medication for her serious condition -- even if the same medication can be used by others for birth control. . . . even if the box says "Birth Control Pills".

[Madcow]

[QUOTE] Dont get me wrong, I dont think a bussiness should be forced to provide Healthcare for thier employees, but I have little respect for those companies that could have aforded a health insurance plan for thier employees and did not provide it or at least share the cost, because of greed[QUOTE]

Even if they have to pick up the ticket for a heroin addict and the related health issues ? How about alcoholics or smokers ? How about if they keep venomous reptiles for pets and get bit, or have pet tigers and get mauled ? Matter of fact, since auto insurance is mandatory, should an employer have to pay some of that to ? believe it or not, greed was the seed this country was born from. Greed built it, and made it what it was until the political class destroyed it.

[DBR]

Originally Posted by ActionJackson

Are you saying that BC pills are potentially poisonous? Sounds like all of those television drug commercials. A drug helps one symptom but creates a hundred other, more dangerous ones. Wouldn't it be safer to find an alternative to BC pills in the first place? How about naturalistic remedies?

No, it's not that they're poisonous. It's just not advised for women to be on them past 40.

Birth control medication or removal of the ovary are the recommended therapies for this malady.

^^^Coming from a pro-union, business-hater^^^

Oh, we could always drag in each other's comments into every thread and just have a running typed gun battle between us. It's tempting because I really don't think it's fair that you portray me in such a way but I just don't have enough disposable time to deal with you this way.

Are you not aware that when a business goes bankrupt that ALL of its employees are now ex-employees without any form of insurance? Is forcing them into bankruptcy a really wise alternative or are you simply allowing your liberal knee to jerk?

Let me ask you a question. Since I have FAR more conservative and libertarian views than liberal, what exactly qualifies as a liberal to you? It seems as though if someone agrees with you on 85% of issues and vehemently disagrees with you 5 - 15%, they're still a liberal.

I'm not a liberal. You can scream it from the mountaintops, do whatever you want to do, that doesn't make it so.

[maine-marine]

Originally Posted by Msurvivalist

Why should someone be subject to a company's religious beliefs, if they don't believe them themselves? If people want to believe in the Bible or whatever, that is fine, but don't try to force it on others.

First it is not the companies beliefs it is the OWNERS beliefs.

Second - Unless the person has been forced to work there they have means to not have the owners beliefs be an influence...it is called finding another job.

Third - the old FORCING your religion on me argument is fine of you live in Pakistan or Iraq... but here in the USA you can walk away or find another job or

[Resto]

[quote=Madcow;5060436][QUOTE] Dont get me wrong, I dont think a bussiness should be forced to provide Healthcare for thier employees, but I have little respect for those companies that could have aforded a health insurance plan for thier employees and did not provide it or at least share the cost, because of greed

Even if they have to pick up the ticket for a heroin addict and the related health issues ? How about alcoholics or smokers ? How about if they keep venomous reptiles for pets and get bit, or have pet tigers and get mauled ? Matter of fact, since auto insurance is mandatory, should an employer have to pay some of that to ? believe it or not, greed was the seed this country was born from. Greed built it, and made it what it was until the political class destroyed it.

Greed: "The Love Of Money, Is The Root Of ALL Evil" Not taking the Bait BTW.