Suicide to Prevent an Agonizing Death (Christianity)

[bearhawk]

I have been here. I woke up in a Twisted pile of aluminum after another aircraft flew threw my left wing of my aircraft at night. I would be awake for a short times and while I was awake, everytime my heart beat the pain inside the trunk of my body was so bad, I didn't know if I could stand the next heartbeat. I was awake when I was put on the emergency room table and knew when my heart quit beating and watched as they tried to get it beating again. Dieing would been a lot easier than living, but this life does not belong to me, it belongs to God. Every minute I get to live is a great gift from God and I thank him for it. Pops

[Catherine_MT]

Originally Posted by PrincessKraken

Horrific suffering is a justifiable reason.

We have a winner here! Thank you.

You beat me to the punch.

I do not think it is anyone's business if I have a horrific dying - horrific suffering experience from cancer or another disease or was facing death from some band of !!! murderers in war time and was near death to take my own life. It is between God and me. I do not care what religious or non religious thoughts other people have in this issue because it is up to the Individual NOT some pious or politically motivated person.

I personally do NOT, NOT and NOT believe in life support - heroic measures given to the DYING, tons and tons of SURGERIES AT ANY AGE OF A PERSON just because the medical system pushes it for a zillion and one conditions, and/or BEING KEPT ALIVE like a freaking VEGETABLE AT ANY AGE! Like a drooling, out of my head - BRAIN DEAD, bag of bones inside thinning SKIN on my 70 pound body when my BODY is nothing but a shell like a GLORIFIED brain dead 'VEGETABLE' with tubes, machines, etc.

I am not for this life support CRAPOLA, my late husband was not, my late parents were not, my mentor - late Aunt C. - family lawyer and my late Mom's BEST friend was not, etc.

Yes, you heard me - I call IT and most of IT - crapola and the MEDICAL INDUSTRIAL COMPLEX and I am being polite here.

People know my wishes, I have made them known verbally and by written word - living will and medical POA along with my REGULAR WILL (POA and executor.) and prenuptial agreement so when I was a widow - people knew what I wanted if some disaster happened to me back east and, later on, out here in Montana.

I am NOT an organ donor either. I was for a brief time - for a few years until I saw that s___ UP close and personal with a relative (NOT my late husband or my late parents/mentors.) and some friends.

If I can't die in PEACE IN MY OWN HOME, not shuffled off to some freaking warehouse aka as old people's JAIL which I do NOT believe in and NONE OF MY FAMILY EVER DID THIS TO ONE ANOTHER, I would CHOOSE to die leaning against a TREE on a mountain top or overlooking a beautiful spot of land or in the ocean - lake - river swimming my last stroke and ON MY OWN TERMS.

Death is between God-Creator and me. NO one else. My husband knows my wishes. I have no children and IF I did - it would still be MY decision!

When I was a premature baby, my parents gave me an incubator and gave me an ng tube for fluid food. They gave me a SPECIFIC time frame to live! I had NO surgery and I had none of the other crapola that they give in this day and age. If I LIVED - I lived and if I died - I DIED. End of story - Summer of 1950. They would not have tried to keep me alive with tons of surgeries either. It was between my late Mom and me - she was in bad health and she had a C section. They did not know if I would live when they took me out of her body and on my original birth certificate it said FEMALE - last name not the name of 'Catherine' as they had decided once they figured out that I was a fighter and ended up LIVING after all. She and my Father decided this with her doctor's input. She was in medicine anyway. She had a bunch of miscarriages before I came along too. They had adopted my older brother and older sister - two different families. She brought my sister to good health - she was a sickly baby. My brother was a toddler and lived in an orphanage too before he was adopted in the EARLY 40's. I came along in 1950.

When my late Mom was dying of ovarian cancer - she always said that it would be terrible for her body (Painful.) but the one thing that she could not stand or 'stomach' was to be OUT of her mind, not in control of her brain/common sense or too doped up on any pain killers - IV or not. Thank God, she, my Dad, my late husband, my late 'Aunt' Catherine were ALL IN CONTROL OF THEIR OWN MINDS even when their bodies were dying.

I have been around dying people and very ILL people all of my life too. Not just family members or close friends. UP close and personal experience.

If you have a DOG IN PAIN and dying from old age or a severe - horrific accident - you get to put them down in a humane manner.

But human beings have this hang up about what is MORALLY RIGHT FOR EVERYONE ELSE in the world when it is NONE OF THEIR FREAKING BUSINESS.

My family members died on their own terms - in their homes or in a hospital. They were NOT kept alive like a freaking vegetable or being BRAIN DEAD (Tied up to machines!) while they drool and lie in their own WASTE of bodily fluids and feces or while they bleed OUT when they refuse any type of blood transfusion.

I was going to write more but it is too personal and hard for me to do when it comes to the 'medical INDUSTRIAL complex' and religious people who think that they know what is BEST for someone ELSE.

Here is MY theory on LIFE, living and death and dying... stay the heck out of MY LIFE and DEATH and leave me alone and I will stay the heck out of yours.

If I was really bad off - I would want to die in my own home or OUTSIDE in a beautiful setting.

Catherine

[Catherine_MT]

Originally Posted by PrincessKraken

Except Job is a parable and really isn't about suffering.

The book of Job is about religion, and how one should not practice a religion by habit, but by thought and careful examination.

Bingo!

Thank you.

Catherine

[PrincessKraken]

Originally Posted by Catherine_MT

Bingo!

Thank you.

Catherine

It is amazing how many don't get it.




Oh wait.





They sit, in Church every Sunday and listen to a Pagan interpretation of Jewish book.



Never mind.


The entire argument between Jews and most Christians makes sense now.

[Catherine_MT]

Originally Posted by PrincessKraken

It is amazing how many don't get it.




Oh wait.





They sit, in Church every Sunday and listen to a Pagan interpretation of Jewish book.



Never mind.


The entire argument between Jews and most Christians makes sense now.

Hello PK,

Another winner here. Thank you!

Take care and may G-d bless you and yours.

Sincerely,

Catherine

[Dead_Beaver]

PK and Catherine, are you jewish?

[survivalminister]

What I find somewhat horrifying is the incredible lack of compassion that some of my fellow Christians are exhibiting. Many times suicide has nothing to do with "faith"--it has to do with mental illness. My mother suffered with two major mental illnesses and she tried to commit suicide twice--because I was over with friends both times and she believed I'd been kidnapped and murdered and she had nothing left to live for. Thankfully God is infinitely more loving and compassionate than many are apparently comfortable with.

[Catherine_MT]

Originally Posted by Dead_Beaver

PK and Catherine, are you jewish?

Hello,

See my post # 72. And a few other threads/posts here.

http://www.survivalistboards.com/sho...=159975&page=4

I am Not in any organized religion at this time. I left the church over 30 years ago.

No, I am not Jewish. I am not in the Jewish religion and I am not in my heritage - nationality. See some other links (Recent/past posts.) about my heritage and my religious background growing up.

I am not a follower of Christ aka a Christian any longer. I do not believe that Jesus was the Messiah.

I think that PAUL's teaching (NT) was false too. Too much to type there! I thought that way for a LONG time.

I believe that the trinity is a false doctrine, etc. I thought that for a very long time too.

I DO believe in many things that the Jewish religion believes in but NOT everything. Plus there are some things that I do not understand in it too.

The above link will tell you where I am at this stage of my life plus other threads here, there and everywhere.

I don't have time to type it all plus I would be repeating myself!

I think that the HRM types of religion are false teaching too. They go so far and then try to get the NT to FIT into the OT and vice versa. But if they believe what they are is the TRUTH... more power to them. I am NOT out to convert anyone.

That goes for people who believe in the 'trinity' - if you believe IT and that Jesus was the Messiah... I am NOT out to convert you either. I used to believe that Jesus was the Messiah myself even if I did NOT believe in all and in some OTHER aspects of traditional Christian theology - doctrine.

Have a nice evening.

Catherine

[Catherine_MT]

Originally Posted by Catherine_MT

Hello,

See my post # 72. And a few other threads/posts here.

http://www.survivalistboards.com/sho...=159975&page=4

I am Not in any organized religion at this time. I left the church over 30 years ago.

No, I am not Jewish. I am not in the Jewish religion and I am not in my heritage - nationality. See some other links (Recent/past posts.) about my heritage and my religious background growing up.

I am not a follower of Christ aka a Christian any longer. I do not believe that Jesus was the Messiah.

I think that PAUL's teaching (NT) was false too. Too much to type there! I thought that way for a LONG time.

I believe that the trinity is a false doctrine, etc. I thought that for a very long time too.

I DO believe in many things that the Jewish religion believes in but NOT everything. Plus there are some things that I do not understand in it too.

The above link will tell you where I am at this stage of my life plus other threads here, there and everywhere.

I don't have time to type it all plus I would be repeating myself!

I think that the HRM types of religion are false teaching too. They go so far and then try to get the NT to FIT into the OT and vice versa. But if they believe what they are is the TRUTH... more power to them. I am NOT out to convert anyone.

That goes for people who believe in the 'trinity' - if you believe IT and that Jesus was the Messiah... I am NOT out to convert you either. I used to believe that Jesus was the Messiah myself even if I did NOT believe in all and in some OTHER aspects of traditional Christian theology - doctrine.

Have a nice evening.

Catherine

PS:

PK is Jewish in her religion and in her background - heritage.

I have not spoken to her other than on this forum. I do not know her personally but I do AGREE with her in several religious matters.

(I think (?) that she is pro liberty - pro gun as I am too.)

I think that she may be Orthodox not Reform but I really have NO clue. Maybe you can ask her again or PM her.

Catherine

[ActionJackson]

Originally Posted by GPArcher

Was wondering today.

SHTF scenario, facing virtually certain death. Most likely quite agonizing.

Even though you would truly love to live your life, you will not be able to.

With that in your heart, you consider committing suicide to avoid horrible pain.

Is this valid, do you think, from a Christian perspective? Or is it still a no-no?

On the one hand, I can fully understand why someone in extreme pain and experiencing acute suffering would wish to end it all. I've actually experienced those thoughts once or twice in my life.

However, Christ went about healing folks who were in dire straits. He healed rather than killed. He was not a "mercy killer" but, rather, a great Physician. The Bible says that if our faith is great enough that we can move mountains. Healing even the worst illnesses is possible but it takes a sound faith. Admittedly, I don't believe my faith would be strong enough but sometimes circumstances can reveal a person's hidden abilities. If Christ is with us who can be against us?

[ActionJackson]

Originally Posted by Catherine_MT

Hello,

See my post # 72. And a few other threads/posts here.

http://www.survivalistboards.com/sho...=159975&page=4

I am Not in any organized religion at this time. I left the church over 30 years ago.

No, I am not Jewish. I am not in the Jewish religion and I am not in my heritage - nationality. See some other links (Recent/past posts.) about my heritage and my religious background growing up.

I am not a follower of Christ aka a Christian any longer. I do not believe that Jesus was the Messiah.

I think that PAUL's teaching (NT) was false too. Too much to type there! I thought that way for a LONG time.

I believe that the trinity is a false doctrine, etc. I thought that for a very long time too.

I DO believe in many things that the Jewish religion believes in but NOT everything. Plus there are some things that I do not understand in it too.

The above link will tell you where I am at this stage of my life plus other threads here, there and everywhere.

I don't have time to type it all plus I would be repeating myself!

I think that the HRM types of religion are false teaching too. They go so far and then try to get the NT to FIT into the OT and vice versa. But if they believe what they are is the TRUTH... more power to them. I am NOT out to convert anyone.

That goes for people who believe in the 'trinity' - if you believe IT and that Jesus was the Messiah... I am NOT out to convert you either. I used to believe that Jesus was the Messiah myself even if I did NOT believe in all and in some OTHER aspects of traditional Christian theology - doctrine.

Have a nice evening.

Catherine

Well ... in the world according to Catherine we know what you DON'T believe and we know that your aren't Jewish, HRM, or Christian so exactly what do you believe and how did you reach your conclusion? What is your "Bible" or guide for life?

[Catherine_MT]

Originally Posted by ActionJackson

Well ... in the world according to Catherine we know what you DON'T believe and we know that your aren't Jewish, HRM, or Christian so exactly what do you believe and how did you reach your conclusion? What is your "Bible" or guide for life?

Hello,

I do not know how to USE the RED INK as you did in your post to me. Are you just asking me in a nice way or are you being super critical of me in a holier than thou way which I do SEE with the HRM folks and the NON HRM folks on HERE?

Since part of ME thinks that you are asking me in a NICE way... I shall answer you.

I came to my conclusion about my beliefs after many years of study, over 30 years, and even more so within the last several years. As far as me coming to the conclusion about Jesus NOT fulfilling what the Messiah was supposed to be... I can't pin point an EXACT day on that. Not that it should matter to you or anyone else here other than in a general discussion. Study and reading did that plus I PRAYED ABOUT IT TO GOD.

I never did believe in the false teaching about the 'trinity' and that was way before 30 years ago. I questioned it as a kid and as a young adult. I do know about the history of all of that, etc. I always believed that God almighty was the Creator.

Go back and read that post that you quoted above. I am not going to retype it all over again. There is a LINK in that post that you quoted.

Go to the LINK. Thank you.

That is MY guide for life, see the posted link - it should be on there - I have posts all over this forum, and it has basically been my guide for life all of my life. Not just recently since I was RAISED that way and I LIVED that way in a sane and responsible manner. I did not do stupid things as a teen, young bride, middle age or now at 62 years old due to PEER pressure and all of that crapola. I actually used reason, common sense and my brains in MY life because PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY and what GOD taught us about the Two Greatest Commandments and the TOP TEN were indoctrinated in me. My parents and mentors led a good example showing that they NOT only believed in those things verbally but they LIVED IT. Only they used to worship on a Sunday. Which to me is fine since they believed it and they thanked and prayed to GOD on a daily basis and taught us to do that too. I pray and thank God on a DAILY BASIS too... not just one day a week - Sabbath or Sun-day or whatever that so many of you go on and on and on about. Although - I do think that Sabbath does mean Saturday and we were taught and told that but we still did SUNDAY church as a family when I was a KID and a young adult. I am not going to get into a p-ing match with any HRM or NON HRM folks about that issue. Frankly, I am SICK of all of that. So I stay away from it now. I am 'un-churched' for lack of a better word as you and many others are in this NATION not just on this forum.

(I am not knocking anyone who has led a rough and tumble life and suddenly came to an epiphany on GOD and getting their act together.)

Here you go...

The Golden Rule and the Ten Commandments.

I believe in God-Creator. Eternal and everlasting God.

As far as reading... I am reading the KJV Bible and some other online Biblical translations (Jewish/Christian.) things as I have previously stated and I do NOT feel like typing all over again.

So I am a believer in God-Creator and I do not know if some people might want to call it a Deist of a Believer in God-Creator who believes in the Golden Rule which is taught in the OT/NT and in other religions plus the Ten Commandments.

Have a good evening. Sorry that I do not know how to write in RED and super large print on here. I have my settings set differently for this forum due to virus and malware issues and other protection on my computer.

I do not want to post/paste the greatest commandment of loving GOD and Him alone, the Golden Rule in the OT/NT and the Ten Commandments. I have done that before somewhere on here as many other people have too. Everyone knows what those things are anyway.

Take care.

Catherine
Excuse any typos and if I see them later on - I will try to correct them. My hand arthritis is bad here.

[Catherine_MT]

Originally Posted by ActionJackson

Well ... in the world according to Catherine we know what you DON'T believe and we know that your aren't Jewish, HRM, or Christian so exactly what do you believe and how did you reach your conclusion? What is your "Bible" or guide for life?

You know, I just read how you wrote this to me in a kind of SARCASTIC WAY... IN THE WORLD ACCORDING TO CATHERINE. So maybe I should not have bothered to answer you after all.

Oh well - no p-ing match for me with you or anyone else here.

I can agree to disagree and agree to agree.

The way both of your sides go back and forth... it is not very Godly to me and it does NOT show a good example for people who profess to LOVE and honor God and to put HIM alone before anything else in their life.

If these comments on how I believe, what I happen to think are the MOST important things in life, that I believe in God-Creator alone and/or how I choose to live my life confuses you or anyone else... oh well.

My hands are hurting here. Bye.

Take care.

Catherine

[ActionJackson]

=Catherine_MT;4996610]Hello,

I do not know how to USE the RED INK as you did in your post to me. Are you just asking me in a nice way or are you being super critical of me in a holier than thou way which I do SEE with the HRM folks and the NON HRM folks on HERE?

I am asking in a sincere way out of curiosity.

Since part of ME thinks that you are asking me in a NICE way... I shall answer you.

Thank you.

I came to my conclusion about my beliefs after many years of study, over 30 years, and even more so within the last several years. As far as me coming to the conclusion about Jesus NOT fulfilling what the Messiah was supposed to be... I can't pin point an EXACT day on that. Not that it should matter to you or anyone else here other than in a general discussion. Study and reading did that plus I PRAYED ABOUT IT TO GOD.

I never did believe in the false teaching about the 'trinity' and that was way before 30 years ago. I questioned it as a kid and as a young adult. I do know about the history of all of that, etc. I always believed that God almighty was the Creator.

Go back and read that post that you quoted above. I am not going to retype it all over again. There is a LINK in that post that you quoted.

Go to the LINK.

Thank you.

That is MY guide for life, see the posted link - it should be on there - I have posts all over this forum, and it has basically been my guide for life all of my life. Not just recently since I was RAISED that way and I LIVED that way in a sane and responsible manner. I did not do stupid things as a teen, young bride, middle age or now at 62 years old due to PEER pressure and all of that crapola. I actually used reason, common sense and my brains in MY life because PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY and what GOD taught us about the Two Greatest Commandments and the TOP TEN were indoctrinated in me. My parents and mentors led a good example showing that they NOT only believed in those things verbally but they LIVED IT. Only they used to worship on a Sunday. Which to me is fine since they believed it and they thanked and prayed to GOD on a daily basis and taught us to do that too. I pray and thank God on a DAILY BASIS too... not just one day a week - Sabbath or Sun-day or whatever that so many of you go on and on and on about. Although - I do think that Sabbath does mean Saturday and we were taught and told that but we still did SUNDAY church as a family when I was a KID and a young adult. I am not going to get into a p-ing match with any HRM or NON HRM folks about that issue. Frankly, I am SICK of all of that. So I stay away from it now. I am 'un-churched' for lack of a better word as you and many others are in this NATION not just on this forum.

(I am not knocking anyone who has led a rough and tumble life and suddenly came to an epiphany on GOD and getting their act together.)

Here you go...

The Golden Rule and the Ten Commandments.

I believe in God-Creator. Eternal and everlasting God.

As far as reading... I am reading the KJV Bible and some other online Biblical translations (Jewish/Christian.) things as I have previously stated and I do NOT feel like typing all over again.

So I am a believer in God-Creator and I do not know if some people might want to call it a Deist of a Believer in God-Creator who believes in the Golden Rule which is taught in the OT/NT and in other religions plus the Ten Commandments.

Have a good evening. Sorry that I do not know how to write in RED and super large print on here. I have my settings set differently for this forum due to virus and malware issues and other protection on my computer.

I do not want to post/paste the greatest commandment of loving GOD and Him alone, the Golden Rule in the OT/NT and the Ten Commandments. I have done that before somewhere on here as many other people have too. Everyone knows what those things are anyway.

Take care.

Catherine
Excuse any typos and if I see them later on - I will try to correct them. My hand arthritis is bad here.

Thanks.

[ann]

Originally Posted by PrincessKraken

It is amazing how many don't get it.




Oh wait.





They sit, in Church every Sunday and listen to a Pagan interpretation of Jewish book.



Never mind.


The entire argument between Jews and most Christians makes sense now.

Really? So the new testament is written by Pagans that simply claimed to be Jews? And gave us their intepretation, as pagans while claiming to be Jews?

[PrincessKraken]

Originally Posted by ann

Really? So the new testament is written by Pagans that simply claimed to be Jews? And gave us their intepretation, as pagans while claiming to be Jews?

You really need to up your reading comprehension skills.