More than half of the Republicans are prepared to let the US default

[TheGecko]

Not sure why you guys are getting all political about the debt ceiling.

It is all manufactured BS. We owe over 11 Trillion of the debt to ourselves which means it does not exist except that it could impact future taxpayers down the road if we decide to pay it back in full.

The foreign debt will always be repaid at the expense of the American taxpayer and this has nothing to do with Democrats or Republicans.

[Sue Doh Myn]

It has everything to do with the republicans & democrats as they are the ones who have run up this debt.

[Bobbers]

Originally Posted by Wayson

Not according to our President, we don't. :P

I'm on the fence about a default. I regard it as eventually inevitable, barring substantial change in Washington (so, inevitable then), but I'm concerned as to what would happen if we defaulted and everyone dumps Treasuries.

We can try to boil the frog or just fry the damned thing. I'm of the 'fry it' persuasion. If it takes an acute event to overcome the chronic nature of the behavior that's gotten us to this point, so be it.

I'll take pain now rather than a slow decline to the equivalent status of Greece ten years from now.

[Melting]

We are already bankrupt, i really dont care what these buffoons do now, its all funny money and games. Kicking the can down the road just buys me more time to get ready.

Not raising the debt ceiling would NOT bring us anywhere close to a default. Anyone who says it does is a economic munchkin. If you owe $4000 and the payment is $200, your salary is $1500, failing to get a credit limit increase to $5000 will not cause you to default. Choosing not to pay the $200 is a default.

The federal payment is 500b, the federal income is 2300b, there is plenty of income to pay the debt obligation. The problem is the feds are spending 3700b, more or less. Stop spending or print the money, they will do one or the other. I couldnt care less at this point.

[aramchek]

Well, considering the Cold War ended a couple decades ago, and yet we still run a massive military industrial complex, with WWII-era bases (and earlier) around the world, large-scale foreign aid, etc. it doesn't look like either party is interested in dialing back the endless war/graft machine. If the Dims were interested in averting a fiscal calamity, they sure haven't shown it. They controlled all branches of govt. earlier in Obummer's term, and he's had 4 years to dial back King George II's wars -- but no dice. As an enabler, he's just here to tell us how they need more taxes for the endless war effort and bailouts.....err...for social programs. Yeah, that's it. Social programs.

[Trent Rock]

More than 80 percent of the country’s leading economists say that the nation’s debt ceiling creates unnecessary uncertainty and can lead to worsening the nation’s financial picture, according to a new survey of more than 40 academics.

Economists: Don’t mess around with the debt ceiling!

[BeardedNut]

Yes, please. Let it default.

[sierra skier]

Perhaps a stop on the debt ceiling increases would wake out leaders up. Possibly while being awake in a non catatonic state they would attempt to balance the budget,,,,,,,

[Harmless Drudge]

Originally Posted by Dragonid

To be honest, I can't imagine who in their right mind would buy our debt now (keeping interest rates low, allowing us to get more in debt). What crazy person thinks they're going to be ahead when the Fed hands them a fist full of funny money.

It's like some retirees I know getting all excited when the stock market burps 300 points after money printing(QE) is announced. You aren't richer. That money printing drove the pricing of everything up, not just the **** you own. Every time that happens, we're all worse off.

What those love-struck octogenarians don't understand is that they are going to be taxed for gaining dollars, even though their investment actually LOST value. Yup, they have to PAY for LOSING. But Barry makes them feel all warm and fuzzy about Social Security, so they'll clamor for every chance to Ed Asner his Kenyan butt into a third time, if given the chance.

[Harmless Drudge]

Originally Posted by Bobbers

We can try to boil the frog or just fry the damned thing. I'm of the 'fry it' persuasion. If it takes an acute event to overcome the chronic nature of the behavior that's gotten us to this point, so be it.

I'll take pain now rather than a slow decline to the equivalent status of Greece ten years from now.

The real problem is that 51+% of Americans are so pig-****ing terminally ignorant that when we come through to the other side, I can easily envision that a majority will blame the few small vestiges of freedom for what happened, and seek to institute a socialist democracy to "cure" the problem. I hope they don't, because that would be a whole lot of people to have to shoot.

[SSGNasty]

Originally Posted by catmando

he mumbled something about the 14th amendment..
the 14 was passed just after the civil war to make sure that the CIVIL WAR DEBT was paid.. it does not mention anything about future debt

Oh so now he wants to follow the Constitution. Makes perfectly good sense to me
________________
"FIRE IN THE HOLE"

[brewmaster1918]

Originally Posted by TheGecko

It is all manufactured BS. We owe over 11 Trillion of the debt to ourselves which means it does not exist except that it could impact future taxpayers down the road if we decide to pay it back in full.

How exactly does this work? Does the Federal Reserve hold 11 trillion dollars of treasury bonds? If so, why can't we default on that? When the bonds mature, do we have to pay them back? Who, in the Fed, gets the money? I'm sorry for the stupid questions, but just trying to learn.

[Harmless Drudge]

Originally Posted by Tackleberry41

This pretty much the way things are. There are no solutions to the problem. Balancing the budget as many would like, won't work. How many would be put out of work if they shuttered half the US government? Or the ripple effect as the money to schools and road projects stopped suddenly. Cut the military, well what about all the jobs that depend on that money. You might call such an event, a depression, but it would be a slow motion crash. Then again it might just collapse quickly.

Piddly cuts to everybody's favorite pinatas; foreign aid or welfare aren't going to anything. Upping the age for SS isn't going to do anything. Reducing our deficit by even half isn't going to do anything.

The only option at this point is punt, put it off for another day. The game is lost, all you can do is run out the clock to keep the sponsors happy. We all know its going to crash, why else we we be on a site like this. We have a little more time to put a few more things on the shelf.

Bullpat! Flapdoodle! Cod's whallop, even.

Warren G Harding inherited an economy that would make the current situation **** unicorns. He cut taxes by half and the federal government by even more, and in so doing, ushered in the greatest economic surge this country has ever seen.

All that on top of being the first black President. If only the current black President was another Warren 'G'.

[Harmless Drudge]

Originally Posted by brewmaster1918

How exactly does this work? Does the Federal Reserve hold 11 trillion dollars of treasury bonds? If so, why can't we default on that? When the bonds mature, do we have to pay them back? Who, in the Fed, gets the money? I'm sorry for the stupid questions, but just trying to learn.

The Fed prints our money and then loans it to us at interest. It is an ab initio monetization scheme. But even then, more debt is monetized without ever printing a dollar than there is by printing it. That is to say, just as there isn't anywhere enough gold to back every printed dollar, there also isn't anywhere near enough printed dollars to back the dollars used electronically and on paper every day for commerce.

In short, the Federal Reserve Note is backed by our performance. WE ARE THE 'GOLD." As such, the Federal Reserve isn't going to just roll over and say, "We bought your performance BEFORE you performed, on these occasions, but now we don't mind that you don't actually want to perform."

Do remember that it is not the federal government's performance that was bought, but OURS. Our labor was sold to them without compensation to us as a form of debt-slavery. But because we have had the ease of exporting inflation and paying for stuff with nothing but inflation, we are the ones who acquiesced to being slaves, and damning our innocent children to a life of slavery.

[tough times]

I would not be opposed to hit the debt ceiling because the spending has to stop. We can't just continue to write blank checks for whatever we "need". Man I wish the government would give me a blank check lol

[Fermion]

I have some government bonds, so if they default, I am going to repo me some prime real estate in Yellowstone!

[airmarshalofbloviana]

Just received a letter from my Congressman, today. He describes the existing proposals as, "unacceptable." Bravo!

[Deadmeat99]

Originally Posted by Trent Rock

Economists: Don’t mess around with the debt ceiling!

Are these the same economists who were perfectly fine with everything that went on during the 2000s?

Yeah, **** them.

[strvger]

so, if the ceiling is not raised would all the members of congress stop getting paid as
well? that would be about the only upside i can see coming from this nation defaulting on it's obligations.