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Old Today, 08:48 AM
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I think 911 was a valuable learning experience for the demolition industry. Now we know there is no need for careful explosive takedowns of steel skyscrapers. Just pour jet fuel in quantities similar to passenger jet tanks and light it up. The building will come down in about an hour.
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Old Today, 10:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 9111315 View Post
It may be simple, but RDX does not drop the building. It does nothing to move the building. There are other forces that cause the building to move.

If the magical nanothermite cut the beams like a cutting tourch, bits of moltin steel would have been scattered in all directions.

Does the nanothermite also cause all these bits to come to geather to form pools and then streams and then lakes of multen steel like some form of replacators from unicorn land?
Old Today, 10:46 AM
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I watched the movie Sully wast night for the first time and was struck by a few things with regard to the reality of jetliner mechanics.

First, the avionics. The procedures, protocols, instrumentation and controls are extremely complex.

Second, the experience factor. What Sullenberger did was totally dependent on his 40 years of piloting experience. Judgement! Skill! Even the co-pilot said that it was a miracle.

Third, the NTSB (our friends in government) were positive that their simulators and computer models were infallible until Sullenberger showed them what was left out of the equation - The human factor.

Now I know that our Popsicle friends' hair will immediately stand up and they will shout - But this was a different maneuver all together. He had no power as both engines were out. He hit water and not a building. Blah, Blah, Blah... I would expect nothing less.

The rest of us understand that I am making a point, showing an example that four novice ignoramuses could not have operated those aircraft on that day the way we are led to believe by our fearless leaders.
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Old Today, 11:01 AM
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Originally Posted by Justme11 View Post
The correct air fuel ratio is extremely relevant. The fact that you typed these words shows your ignorance of the subject.

Condescending remarks are never good form, but at least have the decency to be correct if you utter them.

"Fuel" in this context encompasses anything that when combined with oxygen above ignition temperature will burn. The liquid kerosene fuel was mostly consumed in the initial fireball, with the remaining kerosene adding to the office furnishing fuel for the continued fire.

The air / fuel ratio is always supremely important in determining combustion temperature. Too little air, and the fuel is not completely burned, and emits CO in addition to the other products of combustion. The additional energy that this CO could have contributed to flame temperature is lost, resulting in a lower than theoretically possible flame temperature. Such flames are easily identified due to their "lazy" appearance. This is the type of flame that was observed in the towers as per statements of the firefighters and office personnel that had to walk through the stricken floors to reach the ground.

One described the flames as "licking flames". These flames are a deep red, and emit lots of thick dark smoke.

And of course if too much air is provided, (beyond the theoretical stoichiometric air requirements), this air, which I refer to as "spectator air", reduces peak flame temperatures by the simple act of dilution. Its added mass must be warmed by the flame, thus robbing some energy from it.

Considering also that the beams were quite massive, a HUGE amount of heat is needed to raise the steel to dangerous weakening temperatures.This was not possible given the small O2 starved fires that were observed, and all the more because the beams were insulated "fireproofed" .

It is also worth noting, that in the modern age, office furnishings are all UL certified to be fire retardant.
http://ulstandards.ul.com/standard/?...805.1493508809

MUCH hotter office fires, with MUCH longer burn times, with complete building involvement, are on record that did not result in building collapse. Such a collapse would be lopsided and initiate where the most columns are removed or weakened. Global, synchronous, symmetrical collapse is impossible in such a situation, hence the story that you defend to your dying breath is impossible. (let's hope it doesn't come to that).

If it is you job to defend to the death the official story, then I hope it is worth it to you. But you are wrong. You will always be wrong. No matter how much you type and how much you insult others, you will still be wrong.
I tried to explain about fire pumps earlier. I work as a building operating engineer. I understand the operation of the fire pumps required by code. Building 7 should and would have been extinguished. Even if the water pressure was minimal. The first sprinklers would have opened and even at 10 psi the fire would have been extinguished.

The fuel air ratio is also something I deal with on our boilers. To much or to little and no fire, no combustion. What you said and your explanations are spot on.

An odd fact that some have trouble with is that you can die in to rich an oxygen environment. 21% is what normal. 19.5% to 23.5% is the range.

Last edited by Koolhandlinc; Today at 11:07 AM.. Reason: Just adding a odd fact
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Old Today, 11:12 AM
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Something I learned once in a safety class that surprisingly a lot of people do not understand. Fire is dependent on three elements/components - Fuel, Heat and Air (oxygen). Take away any one of those and no fire.

https://www.firerescue1.com/fire-pro...fire-triangle/
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I don't know if the two towers collapsed terribly uniform. The falls look pretty messy from some angles as they're going down. There is pivoting on at least one of them, and "unzipping" of the exterior.

South Tower compilation from different angles:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qhyu-fZ2nRA

North Tower collapse:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xGAofwkAOlo

I see collapse initiating at the damaged floors, some pivot action (on the south tower collapse footage, 2:30 mark), and the upper floors coming down. And from some angles, you can really see the collapse proceeding in a top->down fashion. Not the case with WTC7, that seems to slip down free-fall.

I don't believe the official/corporate media story, but I do see strong evidence of structural failure. Professional demolitions experts would rig an entire building to bring it down more cleanly. For shock & awe purposes, if what we are seeing is some sort of false flag, probably only a couple floors would need to be compromised for a large building to give way. Once 20+ stories above began to drop at gravity speed, the amount of g-forces sustained to the next lower floors would far exceed anything they could handle, and the entire structure would go down in the top->down fashion we see on the two towers. And as things speed up, gravity will try to make it more uniform -- things fall down, not laterally if they can help it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Justme11 View Post
To carry the official story to the logical end.
If the buildings collapsed Globally, uniformly and symmetrically, it stands to reason that whatever caused the collapse was uniformly distributed as well.

Since the initial impact did not cause the fall, the official story would be that ALL of the beams across the building's cross section were evenly heated so they could all fall at the same time.

Therefore, if you believe this, that means that there would be no stresses induced from the thermal expansion, since it all expanded together, symmetrically, uniformally, globally.

You see how absurd this is?

And furthermore, this does nothing to explain the molten steel seen pouring from the towers, the explosions heard before anything was collapsing, the nanothermite found in the dust, people and material forecfully ejected from the explosions that occured before anything was collapsing.
Old Today, 02:25 PM
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Well, you are just being a jerk now, so buzz off. I am happy to engage in rational debate only.
How did all the cutting sludge from beams spread out over acres of area end up in one pool of molten steel?

Call names if you like, but I would still like to know what forces or magic allowed all the droplets of steel to flow to one pool without cooling down first.
Old Today, 02:37 PM
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Originally Posted by 9111315 View Post
How did all the cutting sludge from beams spread out over acres of area end up in one pool of molten steel?

Call names if you like, but I would still like to know what forces or magic allowed all the droplets of steel to flow to one pool without cooling down first.
Who says it all flowed into one pool?
Some poured out of the building as seen on camera.
I would think most of the thermite cutting would be in the elevator/stairwell area, otherwise the outside of that building would have been lit up like a 4th of July sparkler.
This interior cutting is also consistent with the remarks of the CDI explosives rigger.
Old Today, 02:39 PM
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Then where did the pools of molten steel come from?
Old Today, 02:49 PM
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Then where did the pools of molten steel come from?
What pools?
The firefighters said they saw molten steel flowing along the channel rails, like a foundry. Maybe there were pools as well, but this is the first I have heard of them. there was clearly a LOT of thermite and molten steel as the debris pile was still cherry red 60 days after the towers collapsed.

That fact alone is such a noteworthy observation. What building fire stays hot for 2 months, requiring firehose application as parts are pulled from the pile?

I've never heard of such a thing happening before.
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