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Daniel Defense AR?

45K views 55 replies 17 participants last post by  American ME! 
#1 ·
Hi there,

I've been researching for my next AR, and I've pretty much settled on Daniel Defense at this point. Now my only decision is between the DD M4A1 and the DDM4 v5. My intended use for this is a general purpose Home Defense/SHTF rifle. Here are my main considerations so far:

• Barrel length - the M4A1 has a 14.5 inch barrel with a 2.25 inch muzzle attachment, bringing the total length to 16.75. The v5 has a 16 inch barrel and 1.875 inch flash suppressor, which brings the total length to 17.875. The total difference is barely more than an inch... is the 1 inch savings worth it?

• Weight - the M4A1 has the heavier RIS II and comes in at 6.74lbs, while the v5 has the 12 inch DDM4 rail and comes in at 6.4lbs. The difference is only .34 lbs, but I'm wondering if that will add up over time

• Gas system - M4A1 is a carbine gas, while v5 is a mid-length. In my research it sounds like the carbine gas is a little harder on the bolt, while the mid length tends to have softer recoil and (maybe) less problems cycling weak ammo.

So, in review, the M4A1 is barely an inch shorter, .34lbs heavier, and uses a carbine gas instead of mid-length. Any recommendations or corrections anyone has to offer will be much appreciated
 
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#4 ·
Awesome. Is there anything in particular from your perspective that set the v5 apart?

I just built a rainier arms rifle and I used a DD barrel, mine is a carbine.

I am going to build a Mid-length though.

I can say you are making a good choice....
Good to hear! This will be my first Daniel Defense product... I've heard lots of great things about them so far. Glad to hear one more testimony in their favor.
 
#5 ·
carbine gas system is crap in a 16". Not an issue for 14.5". The 16" is lighter and will shoot smoother by a hair. You can likely run H2 or H3 buffer in the M4A1 and will likely be best with H in the v5. I tend to like more mass. More inertia to strip and chamber rounds in a dirty gun. Since you are not planning to suppress, this is a real toss up. I'd go v5 in your case because that way you can change muzzle devices if you choose and that 1.X" more length isn't really a big deal. Hang a can on it and it's more meaningful. Due to the rail used the v5 will balance better.
 
#11 ·
If weight is a concern, go with the M4 V7 lightweight. I have that one and love it. It does away with the unnecessary full quad rail and opts for the round free float tube that you can attach rail sections to. That way, you only carry as much weight in rails as you need to mount the accessories you want. I find the smaller circumference of the hand guard is a huge plus to me, as my hand easily wraps around it and it is more comfortable to hold.

I run mine with the Daniel Defense iron sights and a Magpul AFG2 foregrip. The rifle weighs noticeably less than a standard 16" carbine and is easy to carry and manipulate.

I haven't tested it at long ranges yet, and have stayed only indoors at the local 25 yard ranges. The accuracy was pretty nice, though. I gave my wife a 1-minute lesson on how to use iron sights and hold the rifle, and less than 30 rounds later she was leaving 3/16" 5-shot groups at 25 yards... resting only her elbows on the bench, and shooting with only iron sights, for her first time ever firing an AR-15.
 
#14 ·
TDFbound - I did look into the V7, but I prefer the versatility of the full quad rail. I like the concept behind the Modular Rail, I'm just not certain it would perform the way I'd expect/desire it to. The rounded hand guard would be nice though...


I really appreciate everyone's input. I ordered a DDM4 V5 earlier this evening.
Thanks again!
 
#19 ·
I don't trust flip sights very much. I've had several different kinds fail on me or refuse to hold a constant zero. I chose to go with the Daniel Defense fixed front and rear iron sights, but I'm sure there are several other quality brands as well. I'd honestly recommend against the DD rear because it's not adjustable for elevation, unlike the LMT or a few others I've seen. I just set mine to a 200m zero, so aiming center mass gets a hit out to a bit more than that.

But regardless, I much recommend fixed sights over flip sights. They are called "backup" sights for a reason- why not simply have two primary-quality sights, one optic and one iron sights?
 
#20 ·
I have the Troy flip up sights on my AR right now, and they'll work in a pinch, but like TDFbound they're known to not hold zero. Plus if I'm ever in a situation where my Aimpiont goes out, the last thing I want to be fighting with is getting sights flipped up. For a rear sight, you could go with the Larue Tactical BUIS QD... I have a couple Larue mounts and they are top notch. From what I understand, the LMT BUIS does provide some extra adjustments, but it also costs a little more.

One thing I really do like about the Troy sights is the tritium option... they work beautifully in the night.
 
#21 ·
Hands down I would get the M4A1
 
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#23 ·
Just my preference

It has the features I would prefer, simply. I would want the RIS, The Carbine Gas system and the 14.5 inch barrel has proved to be more reliable in more testing in more environments then anyone could possibly imagine. which is why it is issued in that configuration. It's flash hider is pined but that's an easy fix. Over all it's shorter. It just comes down to what you like and fits your needs. That's why they make different models. It's just a tool.

Edit: If I was offered one or other hypothetically which is the scenario I envisioned. I'd be selling the Bolt and the Barrel and replacing them with the same specs in 6.8 Chamber II barrel with an 11to 1 twist and I'd upgrade the trigger. The RIS has the advantage of being bolted to the receiver. Making it able to with stand more punishment for those times when it would be possibly used for things it wasn't intended for and I would also want the flexibility of the quad. As for the round I would choose it because I believe that is part of the evolution of the rifle in making it superior.
 
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#24 ·
It has the features I would prefer, simply. I would want the RIS, The Carbine Gas system and the 14.5 inch barrel has proved to be more reliable in more testing in more environments then anyone could possibly imagine. which is why it is issued in that configuration. It's flash hider is pined but that's an easy fix. Over all it's shorter. It just comes down to what you like and fits your needs. That's why they make different models. It's just a tool.

Edit: If I was offered one or other hypothetically which is the scenario I envisioned. I'd be selling the Bolt and the Barrel and replacing them with the same specs in 6.8 Chamber II barrel with an 11to 1 twist and I'd upgrade the trigger. The RIS has the advantage of being bolted to the receiver. Making it able to with stand more punishment for those times when it would be possibly used for things it wasn't intended for and I would also want the flexibility of the quad. As for the round I would choose it because I believe that is part of the evolution of the rifle in making it superior.
My opinion...

m4ris2 is a pig. Lose it. Ddm4 rail is far better...unless you own an m203.
pinned muzzle devices suck. They aren't easy to fix sometimes.

If you want the carbine gas and 14.5 barrel without the pig rail...use the configurator. You can clone it this way without the pig of a rail. If you want to go Nfa or non Nfa you can select it. Pin or dont. I believe they only do non Nfa complete tbough. To do Nfa you need to order just the upper.

that said...can you quantify that the midlength 14.5 gas system isn't as good? It's hard to debate it without logical fallacy.
 
#25 ·
DDM4V5 LW is one of the best all around rifles you can buy, of any type there is to buy. I've shot the LW several times, and will say without a doubt that the weight savings was well worth it when operating the rifle. The little extra heat you might feel if you rapid fire for 500 rounds at a time is not an issue for general target shooting, courses, and SHTF situations. Highly recommend stick with DD, and going the LW version of the V5.
 
#34 ·
I had to come back for a second it was bothering me, I know they made changes to the RIS I but if that's the same barrel nut in your picture that is on the RIS II then they have made it much less robust. And I bet they are the same. That's a shame.
 
#37 ·
Honestly, I know rails are all the rage right now, but I'd suggest getting a standard BCM upper and their lower from Rainier or even a rainier lower shipped to your FFL. Throw some Moe handguards on and a moe or impact weapons light mount. After owning 1 with a rail and 2 without, I like a fixed fsb and moe handguards better. It's lighter and therefore transitions from target to target better.

https://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/browse&category=ar15/m16_receivers-lowers

http://www.bravocompanyusa.com/BCM-BFH-16-Mid-Length-Upper-Receiver-Group-p/bcm-urg-mid-16 bfh.htm
 
#41 ·
When I bought my first AR-15 and finally removed the carry handle to put an eotech on I put an MBUS on it. Literally the next paycheck I purchased Troy Iron sites. because I did not like them.

The MBUS does not have both rear apertures, only the large aperture. To make accurate shots at farther distances than say 100m you need the small aperture. The large aperture is for lower light situations and faster acquisition at shorter ranges but is completely inadequate for longer ranges.

The KAC 600M BUIS doesn't have the large aperture but it does have the smaller aperture. If I must lose one of the apertures the large one is the one to lose anyways.

I also tried the ARMS BUIS and I don't like it because while it has both apertures I couldn't get the small aperture over to the right enough to get a good zero for me. It is annoying to be shooting 2 inches away from the center of the target simply becuse there is metal in the way preventing the aperture from being moved over just a little bit!
 
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