Survivalist Forum

Advertise Here

Go Back   Survivalist Forum > General Discussion Section > Religious Discussion
Articles Chat Room Classifieds Donations Gallery Groups Links Store Survival Files



Advertise Here
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 11-14-2012, 02:02 PM
jazzyfizzle's Avatar
jazzyfizzle jazzyfizzle is offline
Survivor
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: North of the Mohicans
Posts: 5,768
Thanks: 11,088
Thanked 7,469 Times in 3,912 Posts
Default Do angels have free will?



Advertise Here

Do you think angelic beings have free will to choose what they will do?


Or do you think the have no free will of their own?


(or any other understanding)
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to jazzyfizzle For This Useful Post:
Old 11-14-2012, 02:05 PM
Caneman Caneman is offline
Hunter
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 1,104
Thanks: 464
Thanked 1,548 Times in 614 Posts
Default

yes, angels have free will... satan is an angel and by his free will he rebelled against God and 1/3 of all the angels followed him... all by free will

however, the angels will never be a container for the presence of God like people are, that is the big difference between angels and men, both have free will but man is the highest order of creation by God because God chose people as vessels to carry His presence within them (for born again believers in Jesus Christ)...
The Following 8 Users Say Thank You to Caneman For This Useful Post:
Old 11-14-2012, 02:09 PM
jazzyfizzle's Avatar
jazzyfizzle jazzyfizzle is offline
Survivor
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: North of the Mohicans
Posts: 5,768
Thanks: 11,088
Thanked 7,469 Times in 3,912 Posts
Default

..this is off topic, but so you believe that only believers in Jesus have God's presence with them?

Do you think God's presence was with Moses? How about Abraham?
Old 11-14-2012, 02:13 PM
Caneman Caneman is offline
Hunter
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 1,104
Thanks: 464
Thanked 1,548 Times in 614 Posts
Default

yes... there is a "general presence of God" that is all over the universe because He is omnipresent, but only believers in Jesus Christ contain the Personal Presence of God within them... that is the true gift of salvation = the personal Presence of Jesus Christ within by the Holy Spririt in your spirit (say that 10 time, LOL) and this is what Christians need to cultivate...
The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Caneman For This Useful Post:
Old 11-14-2012, 02:19 PM
EdD270's Avatar
EdD270 EdD270 is offline
Recent Blog:
Wanderer
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Arizona White Mountains & Mogollon Rim
Posts: 3,273
Thanks: 2,439
Thanked 2,615 Times in 1,372 Posts
Default

All intelligent beings have free will. Those who exercise their agency to choose to do God's will gain blessings, those who choose not to do God's will get no blessings, all get to enjoy the results of their choices. That may bring either joy or suffering, depending on their choices. Angels choose to do God's will.
It's true that sometimes bad things happen to good people. However, the Lord Jesus Christ has worked out the Atonement which guarantees that the righteous will not permanently suffer any loss due to the actions of others.
The greatest freedom we enjoy is to exercise our will to choose to do God's will.
The Following 6 Users Say Thank You to EdD270 For This Useful Post:
Old 11-14-2012, 02:21 PM
MinnesotaCuke MinnesotaCuke is offline
I love this forum
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 1,656
Thanks: 4,967
Thanked 3,099 Times in 1,374 Posts
Default

Yes, angels definitely have free will.
Old 11-14-2012, 02:37 PM
OhioMan's Avatar
OhioMan OhioMan is online now
Survivor
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Ohio
Posts: 24,646
Thanks: 59,287
Thanked 57,303 Times in 17,360 Posts
Default

YES, I am married to the most beautiful of them all, and she most certainly has a free will!
The Following 6 Users Say Thank You to OhioMan For This Useful Post:
Old 11-14-2012, 06:01 PM
ActionJackson ActionJackson is offline
I LOVED THIS F0RUM!
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 21,913
Thanks: 30,334
Thanked 32,931 Times in 12,710 Posts
Awards Showcase
Top Poster Top Poster 
Total Awards: 2
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Caneman View Post
yes, angels have free will... satan is an angel and by his free will he rebelled against God and 1/3 of all the angels followed him... all by free will

however, the angels will never be a container for the presence of God like people are, that is the big difference between angels and men, both have free will but man is the highest order of creation by God because God chose people as vessels to carry His presence within them (for born again believers in Jesus Christ)...
^^^Nice!!^^^
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to ActionJackson For This Useful Post:
Old 11-14-2012, 06:11 PM
jazzyfizzle's Avatar
jazzyfizzle jazzyfizzle is offline
Survivor
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: North of the Mohicans
Posts: 5,768
Thanks: 11,088
Thanked 7,469 Times in 3,912 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by OhioMan View Post
YES, I am married to the most beautiful of them all and she most certianly has a free will!
That is so sweet!



I am reading the book of Enoch for the first time. Not sure why I have never read it.



Anyone have thoughts on Satan being called Azal'el?
The Following User Says Thank You to jazzyfizzle For This Useful Post:
Old 11-14-2012, 06:20 PM
Tacitus's Avatar
Tacitus Tacitus is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Rocky Mountains
Posts: 60
Thanks: 44
Thanked 80 Times in 27 Posts
Default to Caneman ( & all others as they will )

Caneman, I disagree.

Angels are not out-ranked by man. In Holy writ we read that if man proves himself sufficiently worthy he will become an angel after death ( according to one order of angels or another.) If man out-ranked angels, then by being worthy and he dies he is thusly demoted? No, when man dies and if he proves worthy he is promoted, not demoted. Angels out-rank mankind.


Though, yes, angels do have free will, as do all things in creation.

Even a blade of grass could disobey God if it really wanted.

The Devil's plan was to force obedience. God's was to allow choice of conscience.
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Tacitus For This Useful Post:
Old 11-14-2012, 06:29 PM
Cryptkeeper's Avatar
Cryptkeeper Cryptkeeper is offline
Survivor
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 7,159
Thanks: 4,767
Thanked 5,451 Times in 2,754 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzyfizzle View Post
Do you think angelic beings have free will to choose what they will do?


Or do you think the have no free will of their own?


(or any other understanding)

Of course they do why do you think 10's of THOUSANDS where cast out of heaven along with satan. And satan is/was an angel ,who choose not to follow GOD's commands
The Following User Says Thank You to Cryptkeeper For This Useful Post:
Old 11-14-2012, 06:29 PM
Tacitus's Avatar
Tacitus Tacitus is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Rocky Mountains
Posts: 60
Thanks: 44
Thanked 80 Times in 27 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzyfizzle View Post
That is so sweet!



I am reading the book of Enoch for the first time. Not sure why I have never read it.



Anyone have thoughts on Satan being called Azal'el?
There are many different names for the same people ( and for various reasons.)

Shem was named Melchizedek in the OT by God.

Abram was named Abraham in the OT by God.

Jacob was named Yisra'El ( Israel ) in the OT by God.

The list goes on and there is a reason for it.

Look at what these men did before their names were changed by God and then look at what they had done after. There are specific reasons these name changes occured.

I made an email just for this site. [email protected].

I don't give out my personal email too often till I know people better.

I'm not just a Minister, I am also an elected official ( though not of great importance ) in my town. So, I choose not to put my personal email in a public forum.

Anyone who wishes to have it pointed out where my claims are found in scripture just send me a letter to the above email. Please seek the answers yourself first, before asking me to point it out.
The Following User Says Thank You to Tacitus For This Useful Post:
Old 11-14-2012, 06:47 PM
swordsman51 swordsman51 is offline
Newbie
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 5
Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Default

Hi! They do have have free will. If you look at the history, you'll see that when Satan decided to be number #1 and God decided to create "hell" for him to have dominion over, the remaining angels have the option to choose to follow God or Satan.
The Following User Says Thank You to swordsman51 For This Useful Post:
Old 11-14-2012, 06:49 PM
jazzyfizzle's Avatar
jazzyfizzle jazzyfizzle is offline
Survivor
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: North of the Mohicans
Posts: 5,768
Thanks: 11,088
Thanked 7,469 Times in 3,912 Posts
Default

As far as I can remember, Satan is never called Azalel in the bible, is he?
Old 11-14-2012, 06:51 PM
jazzyfizzle's Avatar
jazzyfizzle jazzyfizzle is offline
Survivor
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: North of the Mohicans
Posts: 5,768
Thanks: 11,088
Thanked 7,469 Times in 3,912 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by swordsman51 View Post
Hi! They do have have free will. If you look at the history, you'll see that when Satan decided to be number #1 and God decided to create "hell" for him to have dominion over, the remaining angels have the option to choose to follow God or Satan.

Do you think hell is earth, (this is a possible concept of a friend of mine here) since some think earth is Satan's dominion?
Old 11-14-2012, 06:57 PM
Kay's Avatar
Kay Kay is offline
Hunter
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: N.E. Texas
Posts: 1,045
Thanks: 2,286
Thanked 1,200 Times in 553 Posts
Default

Yes, I believe that angels have free will. Their most important purpose is to glorify and worship God, followed closely by helping us, protecting us and being with us through the good and bad of our lives on this plane as well as to help and guide us through the hereafter.

I do not believe that humans can ever become angels or that angels can become human. I believe that we are two separate species and do not change from one to the other. I also believe that there are several levels of angels, some more powerful than others, having the ability to allow us to change our paths in this life or to guide us in changing our paths in this life and to intercede with God on our behalf.

I have absolutely no idea where that came from and can't prove a word of it with scripture. I did spend what I thought was way too much time in church as a kid and I guess some of it "took" and some didn't. But you asked what we "believe".
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Kay For This Useful Post:
Old 11-14-2012, 07:08 PM
Caneman Caneman is offline
Hunter
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 1,104
Thanks: 464
Thanked 1,548 Times in 614 Posts
Default

1 Cor 6:3 "Do you not know that we will judge angels?"

God made man greater than angels, for the lesser can not judge the greater....
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Caneman For This Useful Post:
Old 11-14-2012, 07:11 PM
jazzyfizzle's Avatar
jazzyfizzle jazzyfizzle is offline
Survivor
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: North of the Mohicans
Posts: 5,768
Thanks: 11,088
Thanked 7,469 Times in 3,912 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kay View Post
Yes, I believe that angels have free will. Their most important purpose is to glorify and worship God, followed closely by helping us, protecting us and being with us through the good and bad of our lives on this plane as well as to help and guide us through the hereafter.

I do not believe that humans can ever become angels or that angels can become human. I believe that we are two separate species and do not change from one to the other. I also believe that there are several levels of angels, some more powerful than others, having the ability to allow us to change our paths in this life or to guide us in changing our paths in this life and to intercede with God on our behalf.

I have absolutely no idea where that came from and can't prove a word of it with scripture. I did spend what I thought was way too much time in church as a kid and I guess some of it "took" and some didn't. But you asked what we "believe".


Thanks Kay. I do know in Genesis it says the fallen watchers mated with human women and the offspring were 'giants', and that is really expanded on in Enoch, gives lots of details.

I also understand that there are several types of angels.
Old 11-14-2012, 07:24 PM
Kay's Avatar
Kay Kay is offline
Hunter
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: N.E. Texas
Posts: 1,045
Thanks: 2,286
Thanked 1,200 Times in 553 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzyfizzle View Post
Do you think hell is earth, (this is a possible concept of a friend of mine here) since some think earth is Satan's dominion?
There is a "hell" of a lot to be said for that argument. I have considered it myself and I would not say no. I have always had a problem with the concept of a separate physical place for hell and heaven. After all, if we are all spirits why would we need physical spaces anyway? Perhaps we are all in hell now and our punishment is to be weighed down by our physical bodies that go wrong with the slightest provocation, having to spend most of our lives working to survive and spending one third of our lives unconscious. How much sense does that make?

All I can say is what I have said here before: When we all get to the hereafter, we will ALL be in for a lot of BIG surprises. As the words of the old song say, "We'll understand it better by and by".
The Following User Says Thank You to Kay For This Useful Post:
Old 11-14-2012, 08:19 PM
believer0119's Avatar
believer0119 believer0119 is offline
Survivor
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 3,940
Thanks: 4,521
Thanked 8,036 Times in 3,024 Posts
Default

is azazel.supposed to be the scape goat....or the scape goat is sacrificed to azazel....
The Following User Says Thank You to believer0119 For This Useful Post:
Reply

Bookmarks



Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Hello From Los Angels, CA 123 New Member Introduction 12 11-11-2012 11:54 PM
Hello from the City of Angels! LostWonka New Member Introduction 10 10-09-2010 08:32 PM
Guardian Angels...... MountainRecluse Religious Discussion 10 10-06-2010 02:31 PM
Angels and free will Helping Hand Religious Discussion 0 06-25-2010 04:17 AM
Do you believe in angels? Becka Religious Discussion 25 10-25-2008 01:30 AM


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:18 PM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2014 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright Kevin Felts 2006 - 2012,
Green theme by http://www.themesbydesign.net