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Old 05-04-2012, 12:57 AM
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Originally Posted by ZZ7 View Post
What's the point of this comment? These are 2 warriors that stepped up and fought.

You're just as bad as the garden variety WC non-fighters who starts saying sht like "there's no WC" or w/e when their style loses.
Ok....if you say so.
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Old 05-04-2012, 11:01 AM
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If already in the clinch and I have my plum I would forego the elbows and just throw the knees unless i wanted more distance but I've been doing MT so long that once I get the plum on a novice it's going to be real hard to get me off
Yea, I meant the elbows as an entry technique to get the plum. If I get the plum, I throw about 1-2 knees then drive then knees again...repeat (w/o elbows). I always make a habit to drive because people will pick up the rhythm and usually tries duck down and back out, which works well. I know they risk eating a knee to the head scooting out and trainers considers this bad technique, but I sometimes do this when I'm overpowered by someone much stronger and taller.
Old 05-04-2012, 11:06 AM
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A drunk in a motor car is never expects to get in an accident. Hence they drive drunk, crash relaxed and survive. A drunk in a fight is tee-d off and looses all inhibitions and sense of self-preservation hence "liquor courage" They get dumber but stronger in my experience.
I don't think they get stronger with booze. I agree, they just become more reckless and fearless. But their motor skills are grossly distorted now. And they will still suffer from exhaustion through over exertion as they've little control compared to when sober. Some drunk, telegraphing every move by loading up and swinging wild punches off balance is not going be difficult at all.
Old 05-05-2012, 01:18 PM
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Ok, so I just tried out some WC chain fisting on some girls in my Muay Thai sparring class. Then afterwards we did some sparring.

Anyway, these were big, beefy girls who are strong, in good shape and prepping to fight in the ring soon. They still suck & have no chance vs. me though. I was throwing about 8 chain punches as an entry technique. Granted that I'm just copying sht from YouTube, I still have very fast hands from boxing.

WC is really bad. My chin was way up and my whole head exposed, just like in the videos. The girls got flustered with the first couple of times, but afterward, all they had to do was throw looping straight punches at a slight angle or after slipping. One got real mad, took the shtty chain punches and just charged with looping punches....forcing me to revert back to Muay Thai/Boxing.

Didn't try it on the guys b/c they're all at my level, with some better.....I would just get clobbered. This was full sparring for KO's, which has been going on for 3x per week for the past month, so everyone is in kill mode.

And don't say it's b/c I'm not really trained in WC. Fighting is fighting, and I have the experience. Just that WC wants you flat footed, moving in a straight line and with your whole head is exposed.
Old 05-05-2012, 01:31 PM
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Originally Posted by ZZ7 View Post
Ok, so I just tried out some WC chain fisting on some girls in my Muay Thai sparring class. Then afterwards we did some sparring.

WC is really bad. My chin was way up and my whole head exposed, just like in the videos. The girls got flustered with the first couple of times, but afterward, all they had to do was throw looping straight punches at a slight angle or after slipping. One got real mad, took the shtty chain punches and just charged with looping punches....forcing me to revert back to Muay Thai/Boxing.

And don't say it's b/c I'm not really trained in WC. Fighting is fighting, and I have the experience. Just that WC wants you flat footed, moving in a straight line and with your whole head is exposed.
flat footed and no angles is just bad all around I thought WC wanted the person to move in angles when throwing the punches? Please note I have never trained in WC just what I have read. my striking is like yours mix of traditional MT and boxing. Although the girls in my class would take my head off. I got two multiple IKF champions one who has fought for strikeforce LOL
Old 05-05-2012, 02:59 PM
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WOW there is a whole lot of hating going on. I learned real earle that not everything from all styles work. A kenpo instructor taught me a really valuable lesson at 16yr of age.I was 6'2 180lbs and a gg boxer just getting into MA (except judo since I was eight) and thought I ruled the world. My normal inst.was gone that day so his mother took over the class and this cocky kid kinda dissed her. And man did I pay. We started sparring,and we were taught to hit and take hits as part of sparring. None of that shadow sparring for us. Anyway I was kinda dancing around and not really throwing any hits her way (she was in her 50's) and she got real ticked off and lured me in and WHAM she kicked me in the GROIN elbowed me and BROKE my nose and then jumped on me and started wailing on me . I was shocked and finally threw her off.After this was over she asked me why I didn't box her or try to hit her.I told her she was an old lady and I didn't want to hurt her. She laughed and told me that any one can be dangerous and to leard and use evervthing to my advantage NO MATTER WHAT. So I dont diss any style's and I shure don't diss any OLD LADY's.LOL hopes this gives everybody a good laugh at a MA for over 40yrs.And allways branch out every style has it's good points so use them to your advantage.
Old 05-06-2012, 09:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Majorpayne View Post
WOW there is a whole lot of hating going on. I learned real earle that not everything from all styles work. A kenpo instructor taught me a really valuable lesson at 16yr of age.I was 6'2 180lbs and a gg boxer just getting into MA (except judo since I was eight) and thought I ruled the world. My normal inst.was gone that day so his mother took over the class and this cocky kid kinda dissed her. And man did I pay. We started sparring,and we were taught to hit and take hits as part of sparring. None of that shadow sparring for us. Anyway I was kinda dancing around and not really throwing any hits her way (she was in her 50's) and she got real ticked off and lured me in and WHAM she kicked me in the GROIN elbowed me and BROKE my nose and then jumped on me and started wailing on me . I was shocked and finally threw her off.After this was over she asked me why I didn't box her or try to hit her.I told her she was an old lady and I didn't want to hurt her. She laughed and told me that any one can be dangerous and to leard and use evervthing to my advantage NO MATTER WHAT. So I dont diss any style's and I shure don't diss any OLD LADY's.LOL hopes this gives everybody a good laugh at a MA for over 40yrs.And allways branch out every style has it's good points so use them to your advantage.

All of this just tells me that you are freaking horrible as a fighter and nowhere near as experienced as you think you were at that time. People go in rage and sht all the time during sparring when they're getting clowned. It's not unusual. If you're an experienced fighter, you can tell when sparring has spiked into all out 100% power and adjust accordingly. If I can hit these girls at a landed ratio of about 8:1 maybe even 10:1 at 10-30% power while they're going all out trying to KO me (and not doing squat), imagine at 70% power....they will start crying and sht, faces getting busted up, getting KO'd and never coming back to class. One girl, 6'2" and with fight experience, I hit her with only 3 jabs at about 70% and she starts crying.

Guys who sucks that gets mad and goes all out on me all of the sudden during sparring, will go home with head injuries and sht and not come back for a couple of weeks? How do I know this? Because this same thing happens to me when I used to try to go hard vs. pro's who can easily whoop my ass. Now, whenever they go easy and just play with me, I make sure I don't hit them hard and I thank them afterward. I'm not prideful like these chicks nor the 50 year old grandma instructor that "kicked (you) in the GROIN elbowed (you) and BROKE (your) nose and then jumped on (you) and started wailing on (you)". Are you sure this happened or was it just on WWE and you got it mixed up.
Old 05-06-2012, 11:29 AM
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Originally Posted by ZZ7 View Post
All of this just tells me that you are freaking horrible as a fighter and nowhere near as experienced as you think you were at that time. People go in rage and sht all the time during sparring when they're getting clowned. It's not unusual. If you're an experienced fighter, you can tell when sparring has spiked into all out 100% power and adjust accordingly. If I can hit these girls at a landed ratio of about 8:1 maybe even 10:1 at 10-30% power while they're going all out trying to KO me (and not doing squat), imagine at 70% power....they will start crying and sht, faces getting busted up, getting KO'd and never coming back to class. One girl, 6'2" and with fight experience, I hit her with only 3 jabs at about 70% and she starts crying.

Guys who sucks that gets mad and goes all out on me all of the sudden during sparring, will go home with head injuries and sht and not come back for a couple of weeks? How do I know this? Because this same thing happens to me when I used to try to go hard vs. pro's who can easily whoop my ass. Now, whenever they go easy and just play with me, I make sure I don't hit them hard and I thank them afterward. I'm not prideful like these chicks nor the 50 year old grandma instructor that "kicked (you) in the GROIN elbowed (you) and BROKE (your) nose and then jumped on (you) and started wailing on (you)". Are you sure this happened or was it just on WWE and you got it mixed up.
First off your missing the point.Never underestimate an opponent.And this happened 40yrs ago. And as far as your other statements mr billy badass.I don't argue with ignorance because you will only bring me down to your level and then beat me with your experience.
Old 05-06-2012, 06:31 PM
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Originally Posted by ZZ7 View Post
All of this just tells me that you are freaking horrible as a fighter and nowhere near as experienced as you think you were at that time. People go in rage and sht all the time during sparring when they're getting clowned. It's not unusual. If you're an experienced fighter, you can tell when sparring has spiked into all out 100% power and adjust accordingly. If I can hit these girls at a landed ratio of about 8:1 maybe even 10:1 at 10-30% power while they're going all out trying to KO me (and not doing squat), imagine at 70% power....they will start crying and sht, faces getting busted up, getting KO'd and never coming back to class. One girl, 6'2" and with fight experience, I hit her with only 3 jabs at about 70% and she starts crying.

Guys who sucks that gets mad and goes all out on me all of the sudden during sparring, will go home with head injuries and sht and not come back for a couple of weeks? How do I know this? Because this same thing happens to me when I used to try to go hard vs. pro's who can easily whoop my ass. Now, whenever they go easy and just play with me, I make sure I don't hit them hard and I thank them afterward. I'm not prideful like these chicks nor the 50 year old grandma instructor that "kicked (you) in the GROIN elbowed (you) and BROKE (your) nose and then jumped on (you) and started wailing on (you)". Are you sure this happened or was it just on WWE and you got it mixed up.
This is the kinda crap that gives MA a bad name.
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Old 05-06-2012, 07:15 PM
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This is the kinda crap that gives MA a bad name.
Instructors gong into a rage spaz and kicking people in the nuts gives Martial arts a bad name.

at least sparring full blat against guys who are sparring you full blat you both know what you are there to do. But yeah if you want to try your luck against the other guy and get bashed then tough penuts for you really.


The ring or the mat is for fighters. The street is for scumbags.
Old 05-06-2012, 07:24 PM
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Originally Posted by ZZ7 View Post
Ok, so I just tried out some WC chain fisting on some girls in my Muay Thai sparring class. Then afterwards we did some sparring.

Anyway, these were big, beefy girls who are strong, in good shape and prepping to fight in the ring soon. They still suck & have no chance vs. me though. I was throwing about 8 chain punches as an entry technique. Granted that I'm just copying sht from YouTube, I still have very fast hands from boxing.

WC is really bad. My chin was way up and my whole head exposed, just like in the videos. The girls got flustered with the first couple of times, but afterward, all they had to do was throw looping straight punches at a slight angle or after slipping. One got real mad, took the shtty chain punches and just charged with looping punches....forcing me to revert back to Muay Thai/Boxing.

Didn't try it on the guys b/c they're all at my level, with some better.....I would just get clobbered. This was full sparring for KO's, which has been going on for 3x per week for the past month, so everyone is in kill mode.

And don't say it's b/c I'm not really trained in WC. Fighting is fighting, and I have the experience. Just that WC wants you flat footed, moving in a straight line and with your whole head is exposed.
As I said at the begining. Chain punching is not going to win against 1/2 combinations.

Of course you were not in the street. In reality she would have fallen over a homless person and you would have been able to beat her.
Old 05-06-2012, 08:44 PM
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Originally Posted by dontbuypotteryfromme View Post
Instructors gong into a rage spaz and kicking people in the nuts gives Martial arts a bad name.

at least sparring full blat against guys who are sparring you full blat you both know what you are there to do. But yeah if you want to try your luck against the other guy and get bashed then tough penuts for you really.

The ring or the mat is for fighters. The street is for scumbags.
Agreed.

When you take sparring up a notch to "prove something", that's the same as a sucker punch.

If I'm doing no-contact sparring, I expect no-contact sparring.
If' I'm doing light-contact, I expect light-contact.
If I'm doing full contact sparring, I don't expect small joint manipulation etc.

Breaking the rules is the same as sucker punching someone in the face.

There's just way too much macho sh*t, even in the McDojos,
and also, apparently being pulled by 50 y.o. women.
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Old 05-07-2012, 10:54 AM
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Wow... really? That is pretty low IMO.
So you're complaining that I'm hitting these girls too light and should raise the power and knock them out?
Old 05-07-2012, 11:00 AM
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First off your missing the point.Never underestimate an opponent.And this happened 40yrs ago. And as far as your other statements mr billy badass.I don't argue with ignorance because you will only bring me down to your level and then beat me with your experience.
You can't fight, just accept that fact. Sparring for knockouts or ring/cage fight is completely foreign to you. That's why you make up BS stories like this one about how some 50 year old grandma "kicking you in the nuts, breaking your noswe with a full elbow and then full mounted you on the ground and GNP'ing you". You made it up just to make some ridiculous point about "never underestimate an opponent". This sounds like it's right out of the Karate Kid series. If you're going to make up lies, at least make it believable. But if a 50 year old grandma did whoop you like this, like I said....you suck at fighting.
Old 05-07-2012, 11:01 AM
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This is the kinda crap that gives MA a bad name.
This is the norm in most fighting gym. Hell, real boxing gyms have been like this all the time, way before MMA even came into existence. You really can only gauge touch sparring and hard sparring. Anything in the middle, it's very hard to do. Things will usually escalate whenever someone feels they've been hit harder than what's agreed upon. When someone who's much better gets hit too hard, they usually will up the power until they've gotten the other guy back. Then calm it down (unless the weaker guy wants to continue with the escalation). Usually, it does go back down. But when 2 guys of similar levels escalate, it continues that way until the bell rings.

While that guy, Majorpayne's cute little story about how a 50 year old grandma kicked him in the nuts, broke his nose with a full elbow and then mounted and GNP'ed him.....that's right out of WWE. He made it up to prove his Karate Kid parable about "never underestimating your opponent" or whatever Mister Myagi saying. WTF would do something like that just b/c some little kid didn't give them the respect during sparring (by not striking)?
Old 05-07-2012, 11:34 AM
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Holy crap, Wanderlei Silva went too far on that kid IMO.

The kid was going full speed and intensity, but the power was held back. That first foot jab was held back, A LOT....and the spinning back kick was too....by A LOT. His leg didn't even extend fully b/c he pulled it when he felt contact.

Then Wanderlei just punched him hard. Listen to the "SMACK" sound of the kid's barefoot compared to the sound of Wanderlei's fists covered by leather MMA gloves. Barefeet should make a much louder smack upon impact, but it didn't b/c the kid pulled his kicks....while Wanderlei just jacked him up.
Old 05-08-2012, 01:52 AM
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Holy crap, Wanderlei Silva went too far on that kid IMO.

The kid was going full speed and intensity, but the power was held back. That first foot jab was held back, A LOT....and the spinning back kick was too....by A LOT. His leg didn't even extend fully b/c he pulled it when he felt contact.

Then Wanderlei just punched him hard. Listen to the "SMACK" sound of the kid's barefoot compared to the sound of Wanderlei's fists covered by leather MMA gloves. Barefeet should make a much louder smack upon impact, but it didn't b/c the kid pulled his kicks....while Wanderlei just jacked him up.
Slapped him. And now you know what happens when you try to make brazilians look silly.

Kid took it to wanerlei and got touched up for it. Nobody died nobody got kicked in the nuts. Everybody got a hug at the end

Full contact fighting is about testing yourself and making yourself a better person. Sometimes that process requires some panel beating.

Given the chance i would have tried to smash wanderlei as well. And would have accepted getting flogged for trying. I mean how many oportunities do you get to spar top notch fighters.
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Old 05-08-2012, 06:52 AM
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At our Dojo there is a strict rule about sparring without a third man. This is for obvious reasons. It is a common practice in boxing gyms. There should always be a third man for several reasons. First to provide feedback and continually refocus the training. If you don't know what your doing wrong you can not progress or improve. The third man is also there to keep attitudes and egos in check. If at any time the striking begins to spin out of control it should be stopped. It happens. It happens to people you would not expect to snap. Especially with inexperienced fighters. They don't understand the "course of training" and when they are hit and the stress build, they loose cognitive control and begin to let there hands go. Its human nature and very common with new students. You can tell an experienced boxer by the way he controls his hands and breathing, in the same sense you can tell an experienced grappler by his breath control and application of just enough technique to overcome the level of his opponent. There is a Japanese term in Judo for it but cant remember it now, it basically means just enough technique to overcome. It is always in the mind of a reputable instructors and practiced at Dojo's that have integrity.

I agree with Pottery above, no harm no foul with Silva. That kid did NOT get miss treated. If any one was restrained it was Wanderlei.
Old 05-08-2012, 07:09 AM
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Originally Posted by ZZ7 View Post
Holy crap, Wanderlei Silva went too far on that kid IMO.

The kid was going full speed and intensity, but the power was held back. That first foot jab was held back, A LOT....and the spinning back kick was too....by A LOT. His leg didn't even extend fully b/c he pulled it when he felt contact.

Then Wanderlei just punched him hard. Listen to the "SMACK" sound of the kid's barefoot compared to the sound of Wanderlei's fists covered by leather MMA gloves. Barefeet should make a much louder smack upon impact, but it didn't b/c the kid pulled his kicks....while Wanderlei just jacked him up.
I didn't realize that was Wanderlei at first. Wanderlei is the one who held back!
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Old 05-08-2012, 11:17 AM
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I am complaining that you seem to be making light of making girls cry and 'busting up their faces'. Actually seem proud of it.
This is disturbing to you, obviously because you're not a fighter and have never really fought anyone credible. Probably never even fought at all. I keep going back to this b/c you know it's true. You may make up lies and such about how you've sparred for KO's, etc. but you know it's not true. The more you type, the more you expose yourself. This is nothing unusual in a fighting gym. It's very unusual for you b/c the extent of your fighting is slapping the the other guy while wearing a crapload of safety gear.

This girl signed up and paying $160/month to learn how to fight, not slap or play fight like what you do. She was training for her first ring fight. She ended up fighting another girl who I personally was training outside of the class. And just last week, this exact girl, while sparring me, was complaining about how I wasn't really hitting her in the face for real enough, so I lit her up. I know that this is very foreign to you b/c you are not a fighter. You're a pretend-fighter.
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