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Old 07-22-2011, 10:00 PM
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Default Faraday Cage for Home Generator?



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I spoke with a man who sells hardened structures. He says his company has the same capability as the military, to protect home generators from emp or solar flare. To the tune of $70,000. Now to be fair that includes the generator.
My question is, "if the military has this capability along with a privately owned company, where can I get the cage for my home generator?" Has anyone ever found a company that sells just the protection? Is there another way?
Old 07-23-2011, 07:11 AM
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I don't think this is as tough or mysterious and many would have you believe. Protecting the generator isn't that hard.....or expensive. I am assuming its the portable type that probably came in a box.

Just put it back in the box. Then wrap the box completely with aluminum foil or a tight mesh so its completely surrounded and all the "wrapping material" is in contact with itself. The generator is in the box, in contact with only cardboard...right? Not the conducting "wrapping".

The electrical charge....EMP or Solar Flare...will stay on the outside. It will stay in the conducting "wrapping" and travel around the box, not through it.

Want to test this. Get a battery operated radio, turn it on, and put it in a cardboard box. Now wrap the box in aluminum foil completely. Is the radio still getting a signal and broadcasting? Hope not....otherwise there's something wrong with a few of the "rules" Mr. Faraday discovered back in merry old England many years ago.
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Old 07-23-2011, 08:57 AM
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Default not portable

This unit is 25kw & connected to my home. Is there anyway to get the technology that military bases use?
Old 07-24-2011, 07:27 PM
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I don't know who the military contracts with for EMP hardening, but I ran across a how-to for EMP hardening of generators:

http://www.ehow.com/how_6736266_prot...tic-pulse.html

There is a tip at the bottom saying you needed some "heavy-duty surge protectors" for all lines leading into the box. I admit, I am still confused by how you can get a fuel line and air into the box and a power line out of the box without letting microwaves in. Any thoughts?

I've seen pictures of hardened generators on the web. It is just a copper sheet lined box with a generator sitting in it. If I recall it was just a tease. The site had no information about who built the thing. (Sorry I can't find the link at the moment.)
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Old 08-15-2011, 06:10 PM
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I understand big elec. start Gens...but won't the hand pull start ones work?
Old 08-16-2011, 04:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fr1 View Post
I understand big elec. start Gens...but won't the hand pull start ones work?
No, any unshielded integrated circuit would be fried. Ancient units with points and condensers (no electronic ignition box or computer) might be ok.

Is your generator from the 70's or early 80's?
Old 08-16-2011, 10:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kx250kev View Post
No, any unshielded integrated circuit would be fried. Ancient units with points and condensers (no electronic ignition box or computer) might be ok.

Is your generator from the 70's or early 80's?
I don't think that's entirely accurate. An EMP which is the result of a CME (sunspot) wouldn't fry anything that didn't have a long run of cable going to it.

Whereas an EMP from a nuclear blast is different.

Depends on what you're preparing for.
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Old 08-17-2011, 12:40 AM
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What kind of electronics does it use? EMP is no threat to an older generator whatsoever.
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Old 08-18-2011, 10:42 AM
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I think there is still a risk of the voltage regulator or windings shorting from a CME or EMP even if the generator is older. I am working on a faraday cage for my 4 kW circa 1990 generator.
Old 08-19-2011, 11:44 AM
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I started running a quick search for companies manufacturing/distributing EX Barriers and the alike (EX=Explosion proof barriers)... not that it so much apply to EMP protection, but that's the kind of companies I would expect to offer EMP barrier on their catalog...

Any way, only to come to one conclusion; I would say KISS! (keep it sweat simple).
EMP protection is going to be very expensive, require close monitoring/testing and maintenance, upgrades, and you will only really know if it efficient when it's tool late and you need your stuff...

In that respect, prep your geny for long time EMP storage, totally enclosed in it's Faraday box, disconnected from everything (including fuel lines, etc ANY LINE).
And do the same for your spares (in seperate boxes).

Once you've done all that, get another identical geny and play with it if you want. Then it won't be a bigger deal if your EMP preps did not work.

I think the cheapest and the easy-enough approach for us is the "zoning" where your bunker/safe-area becomes your faraday box with you geny (and fuel) inside...
Your EMP safe area must be TOTALLY isolated from the oustide (water, etc ).

You can have an intermediate solution where at times or increased risk, you disconnect and unplug all your supply lines to your bunker...

I realise it not ideal, but at least it can be done and that is how it used to be done (more or less) in the early times of EMP-bunkers.
Old 09-04-2011, 07:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiggily View Post
I don't know who the military contracts with for EMP hardening, but I ran across a how-to for EMP hardening of generators:

http://www.ehow.com/how_6736266_prot...tic-pulse.html

There is a tip at the bottom saying you needed some "heavy-duty surge protectors" for all lines leading into the box. I admit, I am still confused by how you can get a fuel line and air into the box and a power line out of the box without letting microwaves in. Any thoughts?

I've seen pictures of hardened generators on the web. It is just a copper sheet lined box with a generator sitting in it. If I recall it was just a tease. The site had no information about who built the thing. (Sorry I can't find the link at the moment.)
I've been studying the feasibility of a faraday cage for my portable generator, but I was looking for something that would basically stay in place, but still allow me to use the generator.

Based on the above link the faraday cage needs to be a totally enclosed cage in that there can't be any openings for cords or anything no matter how small. Am I misinterpreting the article or can there be a small (1 1/2") hole somewhere without ruining the cage?
Old 09-04-2011, 07:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiggily View Post
There is a tip at the bottom saying you needed some "heavy-duty surge protectors" for all lines leading into the box.
I'd be very skeptical of the whole article based on the erroneous statement about the surge protectors. I'm not sure I have the correct term, but an expert on EMPs said surge protectors won't protect from an EMP because the cycles (or frequency?) of an EMP is such that it won't trip the surge protector.
Old 09-04-2011, 08:31 PM
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Only a couple of ideas come to mind,
A magnetic starter would be perfect so that a sensor would open the circut and open the switch ,a secondary relay to operate a breakaway from the fuel line suction side say a T that opens to let air in and let the fuel drain back to the tank.
A glass portion of that line would prevent any electrical charge from passing that area.
For a sensor it would take a bit of eserach to prove the best ,but off the top of my head I'd ay an LED would be the fastest trigger mechenism. they are very suseptable to static charge . the problem is any static charge is going to trigger a shut down and the fuse LED will have to be replaced ASAP to continue operation.
For many years the Skii areas have had a continious problem with their phone lines because lightening proofing is very difficult . I'm not sure they have found a way around it yet.
This idea is just a guess.
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Old 09-05-2011, 04:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PurseStrings View Post
This unit is 25kw & connected to my home. Is there anyway to get the technology that military bases use?
Yep, buy it from the bloke you were talking to.
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Old 09-06-2011, 11:47 PM
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Default Depends Upon The Electronics In The Gen Set

An older lawn mover engine (Briggs?) usually has its own mag sooss it should be pretty EMP proof. The newer stuff may have modern electronics such as chips and stuff which COULD be very sensitive.

The windings in the gen set should be ok. The battery (if it has one) will be ok also. Just absorbes the EMP spike. Lighting strike surge protectors and breakers won't work with EMP.

An EMP strike(s) are thousands of times more powerful and quicker than a lightning strike, sosss special breakers and clamps are needed to defeat the effects.

You would need nano clamp breakers and clamps designed for EMP. To protect an older good gen set, just enclose it in a metal clad box (tin foil will work) 3 to 5 feet away from wires....

..pipe or metal components and you will be good to go. However....once running, if an EMP occurs, then damage may be done to modern electronics. HB of CJ (old coot)
Old 09-08-2011, 12:10 AM
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Generator would be like a car or truck.as long as it is on rubber it should be fine. Any wrapping for a Farraday Cage is done with ALUMINIUM foil and plastic.ALUMINIUM FOIL for everything--1st wrap in plastis as this will be a sealer-then foil and make sure you tape with a foil tape-then palstic and foil- do this up to 4 x,s. This should cover things for you. As for generator i would shield it now. Make sure you have parts like coild /points/ and wrap seperatly . ALWAYS HAVE XTRA PARTS.pUT A BIBLE in ther also. You will need solice when this hits. You Never find an Athiest in a Fox-Hole- ..Find an old car or truck from the early 70s to drive-They should be on PLUGS and POINTS and buy xtras of those.Now you know why The Cash For Clungker Deal was on.Make up boxes useing screen from old Alum. doors and wrap your boxes with that.This a cheap way . Collect all the screening you can. Use 2x4s and wrap it in screen NOT STEEL SCREENING --DO THAT AND POOF. NOT GOOD-Now that the yelling is out of the way - hide tools and keep a few out so if anyone does scoop any your not out. Better to give than to recieve(shooting) .Find Radios that run on Solar and put a few away. Have 1 on when the solarflash or EMP hits and it will tell you what happened if it goes out OR hook up a few lights from a car(strip a car ) and hang them up hooked to a battery and this may show you.When the lights are out your in the dark. (humour helps) diconnect your computers but some will get fried -keep the laptops with ALL of your fav,s on it cause you probably have recipes and numbers and everything else like me on it. How to make wind gen or welders out of spare parts -also wrap up a meter for electrical for use on cars and 12 volts. ----A 12 volts system is easy to use- When all is said and done take a headlight and hook it to battery and you have a light. Dimmer switches are worth keeping gives low lite and hi-lite-see humour again.-there are lots of things you can do--- First off better find dry ground incase you need it----GOD Bless you and your house and to all who reads this -----Orv
Old 09-25-2011, 01:07 AM
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How far underground can EMP go?
Old 09-25-2011, 02:12 AM
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This article has a lot of good information in it. There is even a part in there about how to protect a generator with aluminum screen you can cheaply buy at a local hardware store. The article states that regular window screen is not conducive enough.

http://www.futurescience.com/emp/emp-protection.html
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Old 09-26-2011, 12:28 AM
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Why not shield the circuit instead of the whole machine???
Old 09-30-2011, 05:08 PM
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Great little video to teach how to make a cheap but effective Faraday Cage for EMP protection. He does two small scientific tests, also! Works! (Without grounding wires)
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