Survivalist Forum banner

357 mag vs. 44 mag

257K views 63 replies 51 participants last post by  reg428 
#1 ·
I'm debating whether to buy a .357 magnum or a .44 magnum - probaly Smith and Wesson, but I'll consider other brands. At the moment, I'm considering a S&W 689 vs. 629. Incidentally, I like Papa's new toy: http://www.survivalistboards.com/showthread.php?t=134850 !

I want a "bear stopper" if I unexpectedly encounter one in the woods, so I want as much power as I can, but, I also want to be able to shoot the thing as reliably and accurately as possible.

(BTW, I already have an XD 9mm for home defense.)

What are your opinions? Thanks in advance.
 
#2 ·
I don't live in big bear country. Just plain old black bear. However, many folks have walked into bear country with a 357. That caliber will offer great penetration. I wouldn't feel undergunned with it. 357 offers deeper penetration than a 44 magnum does.

I would definitely try one out before buying. IF you do buy a 44 magnum, you need to reload. Not only the ammo is close to $1 a shot, you will also like to load it down to lighter loads so you can enjoy practicing with it. I would not get a 44 magnum any smaller than what was pictured in that thread.

However, IF anything bigger than black bear is around; i'm bringing my rifle. IF you feel unsafe in an area with black bears, just bring the 9mm loaded with good stuff. You much more likely to get hassled by coyotes or pigs down south than black bear. Black bears are smart, they know not to mess with humans. It's the humans that are dumb enough not to leave them alone that get into trouble. You see a bear, first make a bit of noise. A decent portion of the time the bear doesn't know you're there. I have done tons of hiking and camping in an area well known for black bear. I rarely brought a gun with me. If I did it usually was primarily for some squirrel hunting. However, when specificly hunting small game in bear area, I do bring a 12 gauge with me instead of the 22lr now.
 
#3 ·
Thanks, SailingHudson. I live in Idaho, and in the vast majority of the state, black bears are what may be encountered. (Only in extreme northern Idaho are grizzlies encountered.) NOW, however, wolves are increasingly becoming a threat! I'm thinking that maybe a .357 would be better suited for my needs - at least I can practice with relatively inexpensive 38 ammo!
 
#7 ·
I vote for the .44.

Self defense is self defense. In a self defense situation you want to bring the most (stopping) power to bear (no pun intended) you possibly can, as quickly as you can.

YOU can adjust to the .44 magnum's characteristics. The gun can not adjust to the bear's.


. . obviously not a majority opinion. But its mine none the less. :upsidedown:
 
#32 ·
the utilitarian (practical) choise would be a 357 magnum, thats a good gun for other things than just bear defense.

And he said the likelyhood of encountering a fullsize 1200 pound male grizzly in his area is small to none. Probably a bit higher than encountering a 10 000 pound crack-addicted african elephant in must, but some times you just have to realize you cant prepare for everything, for which you would want to carry a RPG in case you did.

357 mag will be much more useful in general than a 44 mag, and it will even give you some protection against a grizzly should the small chanse happen that you are attacked by one.

Remember though, most bears are cowards.

They bluff-charge, they will rarely attack to injure you and run away if you scream at them:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bkwy0scRXBU
 
#8 ·
I own both calibers

I reload for both

Both guns have barrels, with that I mean my 357 has 8 3/8 and my 44 has 7 1/2 inch barrel

I use both weapons in the field depending on what I'm hunting

You need to assess portability with your weapon. I would not suggest anything with less than 4 inch barrel with 6 inch being optimum. The longer barrels give you more control, better accuracy, more velocity, less recoil and less muzzle blast with fully loaded cartridges.

Unless you are using strictly for self defense then the game changes a bit

You cannot go wrong with either cartridge

If bear is your concern, I would opt for the 44 mag

Practice, Practice, Practice

Good Luck!
 
#12 ·
If you want a wheel gun by all means get one and enjoy it. But I agree with Goosed, statistics show spray is more effective in the vast majority of bear attacks. Wolves? You have a better chance of being struck by lightning. If you did have to kill a wolf, your XD would do it. A magnum isn't necessary for that. I carry a .357. If I'm around big bears, I carry spray too. If I'm really worried about it, I carry spray and a 12guage.
 
#11 ·
I've camped and hunted in black bear country in AZ, NM, CA and CO for most of my life. While hunting I have a centerfire rifle, and usually carry a .22 handgun. When just camping I carry a .357 mag. revolver with 158 or 180 gr. bullets, jacketed softpoint, not hollow points, and have never felt undergunned.
If you're in black bear country, I'd say you'll be fine with the .357 mag. loaded with suitable bullets. However, if you're going into grizzly territory I'd carry a nice pump action 20- or 12-ga. shotgun loaded with slugs.
I've shot .44 mag and Spl. many times. They're nice guns and fun to shoot. I just can't justify the added expense for the gun and the ammo for no more increase in power than they give. Other alternatives are the .41 mag, if you can find one, and a NEW .45 Long Colt. they give more power than the .357, but less recoil and noise than the .44, and the .45 LC can be handloaded to produce .44 mag. ballistics in new guns made to handle the pressures.
 
#57 ·
Everyone recommends a shotgun with slugs. On the surface it sounds pretty good, but a lot of slugs penetrate like crap, and would be a poor choice. But then there are a few good choices too. Brenneke is the only one offhand that I can say is made for tough game.

You mention a "new" .45 Colt being capable of being handloaded to much higher levels of power; that is an only an accurate statement when referring to Ruger Blackhawks, Redhawks, and the large frame Vaquero. The small frame Vaquero, and Colt copies are in no way built to handle the extra pressure. There are probably a bunch of guns that are built strong enough, like Freedom Arms, but it is much easier mentioning a few that can take it (for sure) rather than the majority that just aren't built for it.

I agree that it is nicer shooting a big bore handgun at lower pressure for your ears sake rather than push a small one to where it instantly deafens you.
 
#18 ·
If you dont have any wrist issues and are a fairly beefy fellow go with the 44 mag with a nice big comfy grip. That thin wood grip looks nice but will hurt your hand eventually. Ive shot with both types of grip and the big comfy ones work great, the wood sucks.
If you are a smaller fella and have small wrist then go with the 357 with the comfy grip.
 
#22 ·
A lot of good replies here already, so I'll just toss my .02 in and head out. If I was going to get one or the other, it'd likely be a .44 magnum in general...excellent performance against two legged predators with .44 special loads, excellent shot column for snake shot, and with hard cast lead projectiles it'll just about enter a bear's mouth and exit his rear.

That being said, I'd rather have a .41 magnum, my newest toy. A 210 grain LSWC being pushed by AA9 powder can hit 1500 fps, and has plenty of penetration for black bear. Can be downloaded to the original velocities intended (what I call .41 police) at about 1000 fps for social work, and still allows you to shoot quite a bit of shot for snake shot.

That said, really, either of the three calibers should be more than adequate for what you're talking about. I've shot black bear with .357 magnum in a lever gun and it worked perfectly fine for taking them down, but I wouldn't want to trust it were it me against a charging bear.

I'd recommend you look at the Taurus Tracker line of revolvers. Butt ugly, but fine functioning and in my instance quite accurate little beasts. A flitz trigger job and a bit of stoning gave it a silky smooth trigger, and a new set of wolff springs gave it a 10 lb DA trigger pull, with a 3.4 lb single action pull, more than good enough for me. Also quite lightweight, which is a bigger consideration than most people think it is, if you're carrying it into the backwoods where you might encounter a bear.
 
#23 ·
I have a couple of each, and love them both, but I'd choose the 44.

A 4" 629 doesn't kick THAT hard really. I have a 4" Dan Wesson that snaps back about as hard as my 4" 44.
Houge rubber grip, regular old factory 240gr JSP's(I think Magtechs are around 1180-1200fps or so) or lower level handloads and youre set.

Start getting up into the 310gr/1400fps .44 stuff, and you'll want a heavier frame and longer barrel.

Both are very capable for your needs. There isn't a wrong choice.

My favorite kicking around revolver is my 4" 629, with 250gr K.hardcasts, at around 950-1000fps.
Accurate, mild, and will penerate all you need it to.
 
#38 ·
My favorite kicking around revolver is my 4" 629, with 250gr K.hardcasts, at around 950-1000fps.
Accurate, mild, and will penerate all you need it to.
That will do anything 99.9999% of people will ever need a handgun to do.

I would stay away from Smith and Wesson because they sided with the Clinton administration on the assault weapons ban in exchange for government contracts. They should never be forgiven for being a traitor. Smith and Wesson is the Benedict Arnold of gun companies.

Go with the Ruger Redhawk in stainless and as others have stated, reload your ammo. You can load a 44 that is subsonic. I wouldn't use the subsonic on bear though, it would anger them to no end.
So you advocate a ban on S&W for what it's former British owners did, but Ruger is OK?

:rolleyes:

Both S&W and Ruger have had new owners and management for years, and both companies have expressly supported pro gun groups to the tune of millions of dollars. Both companies manufacture guns today by the hundreds of thousands that would make Billary shriek.

Punishing either company or their American workers for what their former owners and management did or said, is moronic.

..
 
#25 ·
44 mag is a good round and will take down most bears. I large bear may kill you before your shots kill him. That could be a problem.

I would stay away from Smith and Wesson because they sided with the Clinton administration on the assault weapons ban in exchange for government contracts. They should never be forgiven for being a traitor. Smith and Wesson is the Benedict Arnold of gun companies.

Go with the Ruger Redhawk in stainless and as others have stated, reload your ammo. You can load a 44 that is subsonic. I wouldn't use the subsonic on bear though, it would anger them to no end.
 
#26 ·
.357 OR .44......of the two, I'd take the .44mag - in a Ruger Redhawk 5 1/2' or Smith & Wesson M29 4" barrel. The .44mag is very versatile - can be handloaded "soft & slow" or "Hot & HEAVY" !!! The 5 1/2" or 4" barrel makes for easy carry on your hip - while a longer barrel (6" to 8 3/8") would make an excellent hunting set up.
The .357mag is also very versatile and has less recoil than the .44mag. The .357 can also be had in smaller framed revolvers than the heavier .44 mag.
Either way - remember - caliber doen't matter if you miss - Practice, Practice,Practice
 
#27 ·
My choice is the .44. There's a lot of versatility in that cartridge. With proper loads, a .357 will not out penetrate it. Here's an idea of what a heavy .44 mag can do. These loads won't work in all .44 magnums though. http://www.garrettcartridges.com/44mag.asp

The .44 takes a little more work to master than the lighter recoiling .357. That's the downside. But it's not a hard gun to shoot well with after some practice.

If you're going into known bear territory though, a rifle or shotgun would still be a better choice than a handgun though.
 
#29 ·
Well if it's strictly for bear defense the 44 should be good. I think the 357 is better than most people think. My reason for this is that most people shoot their 357s far more often than they shoot their 44's. Those bears move awful fast and you need to be able to hit the target in a moments notice.
Neither come even close to being as good as a rifle or shotgun though
 
#31 ·
I remember an article by Bob Milek about shooting a black bear with a .357 and having the projectiles fail to penetrate the skull. I have hunted, and followed gun and hunting magazines for about 40 years. Nobody with any experience has ever recommended a .357 for defense against even a black bear. Two guys in Main put 13 rounds of 30-30 Winchester into the chest of a black bear before it went down. A friend of mine knocked one down with a .300 mag that glanced off its skull at 100 yards. It shook it's head, got up and charged. The next shot disintegrated the heart and one lung. The bear came almost 100 yards on adrenalin. If one is at all ****ed off, I suggest nothing less than a 12 guage with high quality slugs - preferably the saboted 300 grain copper hollow points. For last ditch self defence nothing less than a .44 mag, or a .45 Colt in a strong gun loaded to that power level. If I had only a .357, rather than risking ****ing him off I would throw it at him, and use the moment of distraction to climb a tree. The .357 is a wonderful gun but not even close to the .44 in power. You want maximum loads with a 300 to 320 grain projectile. They will penetrate both shoulders of a moose and keep right on going.
 
#33 ·
in the country im from, 357 magnum is used for defense against polar bears, which is a much larger and more dangerous and aggresive animal than both grizzly bears and especially black bears.

a mid sized 357 mag load will be aprox equal to 10mm

in addition, bears will run towards you and bluffcharge as i specified above here, thats entirely normal but it doesnt mean its going to attack you. Polar bears though have adapted theyre instincts to the polar region and are the only predator on earth that will actively hunt humans, and they are the largest predator that walks on land, larger than both the grizzly or the famous kodiak bears. While a grizzly bear can kill you if it has a bad day and you annoy it, it will normally avoid you or just try to scare you away with a bluff charge (like the black bear), while a polar bear will hunt you with the intension of killing and eating you.

When 357 magnum is considered fine against them, it should do very well against a small black bear.
 
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top